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Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

mozillapetition.com

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Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#361

Post by rwmj »

cmcaleer wrote: post #359
hu3 wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2023 $653M That's almost all Google money. CEO's largest accomplishment since 2007 was to put Mozilla on the brink of shutting down anytime Google's money stops flowing in.

Imagine if a competent CEO had been at the wheel. Instead of spending quite literally billions on who knows what (certainly not a significantly better, more competitive Firefox), Mozilla could have instead transitioned to an endowed foundation model and built a sustainable, long-term future that could weather a scenario like today’s DOJ case which was not impossible to foresee (US v. Microsoft was in 2001 after all).

They were competently directing that money into their bank accounts.

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#362

Post by bmacho »

I've read the petition. I'm not convinced. However, this must be the single most harmful petition I've ever read (IMO).

I believe that Google money is a huge net positive for Firefox: free money for basically nothing asked in return.

Additionally I think that the biggest problem of Firefox have been Mozilla for 10-15 years and there is no sign of improving, only getting worse and worse. I wish Firefox could ditch Mozilla (and probably keep Google money flow if possible).

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#363

Post by fellerts »

derkster wrote: post #240
brooke2k wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never once had an issue with a website that was solved by opening it in Chrome instead. and I switched to firefox like three years ago. If firefox is so much less supported, I'm not seeing it at least

I've been bringing this up in every single thread about Chrome and Manifest V3 pops up. I'm been using Firefox, 100% of the time, on three different operating systems, for probably six years at this point. I can remember a single time I had to swap to Chrome for something, and it was three years ago, and involved some flavor of WebAssembly, I believe. If anyone can point out a current website that is acting up under…

Huddles in Slack don't work on Firefox on Linux: https://github.com/aws/amazon-chime-sdk-js/issues/2044. Works fine in Chrome.

This is the only reason I keep the Slack "desktop app" around.

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#364

Post by internet_points »

iteratethis wrote: post #79

We need to be honest about what value Firefox really has left. Commercially, it's completely irrelevant. On big websites it doesn't even show up in the top 10 browsers and it's almost entirely absent on mobile. Site owners can readily ignore Firefox. Firefox is no longer a developer default. I'm sure some of us in our bubble have strong personal preferences but the entire dev ecosystem is chrome-based. Very advanced…

Those arguments all sound like "We nearly have a monoculture so let's embrace the monoculture and give up". The downward curve needs to be counter-acted, not accelerated.

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#365

Post by subsistence234 »

ToucanLoucan wrote: post #157
theandrewbailey wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me repeat myself: > All I ever wanted from Mozilla was a browser Firefox is the best alternative to a Chromium/Google dominated web. As long as Firefox isn't kicking ass and being used by, say, 20% of web users, I argue that Mozilla shouldn't be doing anything else. This is especially prudent when a large part of Mozilla's (and therefore, Firefox's) funding is in jeopardy. So, yes, I have a problem with Mozilla d…

[flagged]

Quite a few people would donate for Firefox development, but they can't donate to Mozilla because Mozilla spends the money on other stuff. Until now, as Google's lapdog, Mozilla didn't need donations, so that wasn't a problem (for Mozilla, it did however result in firefox getting 2.62% market share).

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#366

Post by subsistence234 »

metabagel wrote: post #243
BearOso wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question is more "Do these events and keynote speakers in Zambia have anything to do with browser development?" This isn't supposed to be a generic non-profit charity, it's a non-profit for supporting web browser development. If only 5% of the funds are going toward the browser or related technology, the organization is corrupt.

The question is how much did Mozilla actually spend on this conference? I'm guessing it may have been a pretty small cost.

It's not about that one conference.

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#367

Post by pyaamb »

bdangubic wrote: post #171
magicmicah85 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use Firefox for Container tabs. It’s useful for sites where I can’t have multiple tabs opened to same site but different login. That’s my main reason for sticking to Firefox.

just curious - why not use browser profiles available in Chrome/Brave…?

I wish they improved the UX so that it is as easy as possible to switch between profiles and to always launch certain websites on isolated profiles that you set for them

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#368

Post by Jzush »

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #27

Not looking to grind an axe but facts matter in this case. Let's look at Mozilla's financial statement for 2007 and 2023 [0][1]: > Expenses 1. Program 'Software Development' 2007: 20.7M | 2023: 260M 2. Management 'General and Administrative' : 2007: 5.1M | 2023: 123M I am purposefully excluding marketing and fundraising costs. Because arguably you can't get away from those expenses. Let's ignore inflation and COL and…

In general it has been my experience that administrators primary functions are to justify administrators jobs. Usually by any ill considered and ill researched manner as possible.

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#369

Post by subsistence234 »

nightpool wrote: post #197
jillesvangurp wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The good news is that development could easily be funded by donations. It's only a few million. Enough to keep a few dozen people employed. The bad news is that donations are unlikely to happen with the current massive misspending on overpaid people with no technical background that don't code that spend 95% of their budget on themselves, support staff that also doesn't code, offices they don't need, commercial produ…

The good news is that development could easily be funded by donations. It's only a few million. Enough to keep a few dozen people employed. Huh? Mozilla currently spends $260M on browser development, of which >90% is salaries. Where are you getting this "it's only a few million" idea from?

> Mozilla currently spends $260M on browser development,

Mozilla spends that on development, but firefox is only a small part of that.

Re: Tell Mozilla: it's time to ditch Google

#370

Post by subsistence234 »

bruce511 wrote: post #247
zamalek wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how many of this angry crowd donate. Mozilla do accept donations. Or maybe the idea is that employees/developers don't need to eat, which is incredibly ironic given who HN users typically are. There isn't a single line in this petition dedicated to how Mozilla should raise funds instead. Maybe signing the petition should be behind a paywall, I would be very interested to see how many votes that would gather.

You're getting downvotes, but I'm not sure why. It's trivial to say something like "wean off Google" and it's another thing to suggest an alternative source. The truth is, there are no actual ideas on how to replace it. Donations is not the answer. You can't replace hundreds of millions of $ simply with donations. Equally you can't just reduce spending by firing swathes of people Twitter style. And even if you could…

>you can't just reduce spending by firing swathes of people Twitter style.

mozilla probably could.

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