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Go European: Discover European products and services

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Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#371

Post by wodenokoto »

DaveMcMartin wrote: post #225

It’s genuinely sad to see the world splintering into waves of nationalistic protectionism. Not long ago, we had something promising, a slow but steady crawl toward a united global community. Progress was gradual, sure, but it was real. Countries could specialize and trade freely: I’d buy your chips, you’d buy my steel, and we’d both come out ahead. It worked. Now, though, it’s all about "national sovereignty" and "in…

> "Not long ago, we had something promising, a slow but steady crawl toward a united global community."

How long ago was not long ago in your eyes?

I'd say, the promise of international trade and globalization uniting the world fell apart some time in the 2000 or 2010s with China showing they would not open up to ideas of human rights and personal freedom. The sales pitch for investing in China (from a political point of view) was that we could trade the communism and fascism out of them.

Then in Russia showed that we couldn't trade our way to peace. The idea was that cheap gas from Russia would make Europe and Russia dependent on either side of the deal, and we wouldn't disturb world peace and break the trade. That didn't go well.

And now America wants to but limit trade with their biggest trade partners and closest allies, in the hopes that it'll bring them manufacturing prowess.

My economics professor in 2005, said the world was more globalized in the wake of WWI. I don't know if that was true, but at least they didn't have passports back then.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#372

Post by zppln »

lentil_soup wrote: post #319
zppln wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure. My microwave from 1988 is about the only thing made in the US in my home (interstingly an Electrolux). However, every purchase I make is with a Visa card. Most services I use are American. And as I'm typing this... anyone know a European alternative to SwiftKey? :P

Electrolux is Swedish though. Or you mean it was actually built in the US but sold by Electrolux?

Built in the US and sold by Electrolux, yes.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#373

Post by SideburnsOfDoom »

pjc50 wrote: post #292
RobotToaster wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people who voted for Brexit were mostly concerned about free movement of people, not goods. I doubt a free trade agreement would upset them too much . If the EU would accept a FTA without free movement of people is another matter.

> If the EU would accept a FTA without free movement of people is another matter. Absolutely not. This was made clear repeatedly. What became clear in the UK was that we'd rather lose market access in order to appease people with an irrational hatred of our fellow Europeans. If people think trade and movement boundaries are good, why don't we have internal ones? Why should Mancunians be allowed to take up scarce hous…

You are correct.

EU: "The free movement of goods is one of the four fundamental economic freedoms laid down in the EU founding treaties, the other three being the free movement of capital, services and people."

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/EN/legal-content/glossary/free-mov...

> "The single market seeks to guarantee the free movement of goods, capital, services, and people, known collectively as the "four freedoms" "

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_single_market

The EU would welcome the UK being closer aligned to the EU, trade-wise. But the UK cannot be in the single market without all four freedoms. Which the UK still rules out.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#374

Post by mentalgear »

nec4b wrote: post #335
mentalgear wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Housing is a fundamental human right. Corporations should not be allowed to buy or hold large amounts of residential property or zoned housing land. They create artificial scarcity by holding it back, driving up prices purely for profit. A less direct but still effective approach is to restrict residential property purchases to citizens. This helps prevent international hedge funds and (sovereign) wealth-funds from m…

>> Housing is a fundamental human right. No it's not. A fundamental human freedom is to build or to buy a house. Nobody is owned a house.

Please read: We are talking about housing, which is not ownership.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#375

Post by mentalgear »

whatever1 wrote: post #279
mentalgear wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Housing is a fundamental human right. Corporations should not be allowed to buy or hold large amounts of residential property or zoned housing land. They create artificial scarcity by holding it back, driving up prices purely for profit. A less direct but still effective approach is to restrict residential property purchases to citizens. This helps prevent international hedge funds and (sovereign) wealth-funds from m…

Rich people have smart folks whose job is to think ways to avoid regulation. In your example they would probably just have puppet citizens who buy land on their behalf. Sure the cost would be a bit higher because the puppets would demand some commission, but hey it’s the cost of running business. It’s close to impossible to regulate concentrated money. See the drug cartels or Musk as two examples. The cartels operate…

While I can understand your cynicism, and I know the reality of loopholes, it would make it much harder.

Also, consider the more "puppets" needed, they less stable the system becomes, and the more likely a "puppet" exposes the system (as whistleblowers in the mafia).

In any case, the thinking can't be "it's too hard, we can't do anything anyhow" because then society is really f-ed and the rich get what they want: hopelessness and conformity.

Again, there are examples of northern & Scandinavian countries that did this with great results. It's just a matter of pushing through.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#376

Post by nonrandomstring »

dumbledoren wrote: post #299
nonrandomstring wrote: post #101

Breakups are painful. A great battle is afoot on the "data sovereignty" ground, for sure. It's over a year since I spoke at Cloud Native Media [0] on the urgent need to extricate sensitive processes and data from US American companies. At the time there were a few angry reactions - mainly from people accepting the risks for the first time and acknowledging how deeply enmeshed/dependent their operations are. Most of t…

> It's March 2025 and the US has gone full-fascism. It's amazing to see people say things like this as if the US was any different before. Trump just put an honest face on fascism and imperialism. Before, they were exercised in a 'polite', polished manner. Even by Obama who stomped down the Occupy Wall Street.

It's amazing to be the one saying it! I'm generally reflective and reluctant to take up slogans. But once the jackboots started proudly and openly signalling it on the world stage, it got a bit difficult to keep pretending otherwise. God knows we all tried. For at least 10 years anyone who spoke of what they saw coming was attacked, banned, piled-on and ridiculed.... all those "Good People" (many of them here) did the fascists work for them. It's understandable. Nobody wants to feel uncomfortable, right? But now is the time for more self-honesty.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#377

Post by account42 »

RobotToaster wrote: post #212
ChocolateGod wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whilst a good idea, no politician is going to try and do it under the fear of reigniting the Brexit argument which ends up dominating politics in the country.

Most people who voted for Brexit were mostly concerned about free movement of people, not goods. I doubt a free trade agreement would upset them too much . If the EU would accept a FTA without free movement of people is another matter.

Yet those people are not at all concerned with free movement of non-European "refugees" now.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#378

Post by tmcdos »

neuronic wrote: post #208
Separo wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Thank you for including the UK, we are still part of Europe! Always. hug

Let's get Russian disinformation and influence out of Europe and heal the European relationships. Cannot wait to see Farage begging for food in the subway.

There is also non-Russian disinformation - beware of it.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#379

Post by Galatians4_16 »

dumbledoren wrote: post #305
wolvesechoes wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if they return Constantinople.

"Return" to whom. Byzantium was never "European", it was shunned at its time by entire Europe - by both the Catholic Mediterranean parts and the Germanic parts. The Romaioi (as the Byzantines called themselves) turned into Ottoman Rums as the empire was a multi-cultural, multi-national empire united under the banner of Ottoman-ness. The uncle of the fallen emperor, who was next in line for being the Byzantine emperor…

Return to Constantin Opel. The German car guy.

Re: Go European: Discover European products and services

#380

Post by wouldbecouldbe »

kergonath wrote: post #362
wouldbecouldbe wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If only it was so simple, there are of course many conflicting interests in Europe, with certain countries who are more export oriented for instance benefiting from a weak Euro and others from a stronger Euro etc.

There are. But the good thing is that all these countries get to sit around a table and talk, when there are such disagreements. And things get (mostly) sorted out in a civilised way.

Not sure if you are been to the EU. There is not table where they talk, they just compromis and ignore along the way and then the commission decides everything behind closed doors, which might be your table
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