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Fasting & Programming

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Re: Fasting & Programming

#121

Post by beagle3 »

anthonyb wrote: post #120
leocassarani wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And probably good for you - it means your body is finally getting rid of some stuff it should have gotten rid of before and didn't. That sounds like the sort of pseudo-scientific, unsubstantiated nonsense you hear all the time from New Age healer types. Do you have a source to back up your claim?

It's ketosis from ketones being produced as a byproduct of converting fat into glucose. Nothing to do with toxins.

Sounds reasonable. Can you explain why "acetone breath" only happens to some of the faster, and never (AFAIK) more than once per fast, or other than in the beginning? If it was as simple as you describe, it should be very consistent or completely random.

p.s: I don't see anyone mentioning toxins before you did

Re: Fasting & Programming

#122

Post by saraid216 »

makmanalp wrote: post #98
saraid216 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was the risk of getting mauled while doing this?

The majority of edible animals are not big game (by nature of the food pyramid), and a even a decent chunk of big game are not predators of humans. Plus, it's easy to overwhelm them if you have more than one person. I've never hunted before, but I can't imagine at all that it's a fair fight. Humans have been known to trap them, net them, flank them, shoot them at a distance, lure them, corner them, smoke them out etc…

> Are you really going to argue that any human with any semblance of intelligence (and I don't mean deep thought here) would have to risk mauling to hunt for subsistence?

That's why we invented farming, dear.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#123

Post by ralfn »

enqk wrote: post #86
tejaswiy wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Normally my brain is thinking 10 different things at one time. It is fairly difficult for me to focus (more so since I work at an office that has 5 TVs that I can see, and a couple of channels I can hear). I think a part of the reason why programmers prefer working late hours (late as in after 12 in the night) is that the brain is sufficiently tired as to not be able to jump all over the place. You'd focus on one t…

Or you think you are focusing on code, and just are too tired to notice context-switches or general slowness.

The illusion of productivity can actually increase productivity.

The feeling of gettings things done motivates. Even when that feeling is an illusion.

So what if it actually took 4 hours: if it feels like 30 minute, its easy to invest another "30 minutes".

Re: Fasting & Programming

#124

Post by michaels0620 »

beagle3 wrote: post #100
manmal wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's what works best for fat-loss, because that way you keep down the blood sugar spikes after every meal. I don't do it though because it's too much of a hassle - instead, you can also keep to foods which don't spike sugar levels much in general.

> It's what works best for fat-loss, because that way you keep down the blood sugar spikes after every meal. That's a hypothesis that afaik no study was able to support (e.g. http://www.webmd.com/diet/features/truth-about-6-meals-day-w... about some studies. I don't have more references right now, but in the past I was looking for a study that supports it, and only found negatives) > instead, you can also keep to foo…

The other issue with people like me who chronically over eat, is that asking me to eat 6 small meals a day is like asking an alcoholic to go to a bar 6 times a day but only order pepsi.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#125

Post by anthonyb »

beagle3 wrote: post #121
anthonyb wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's ketosis from ketones being produced as a byproduct of converting fat into glucose. Nothing to do with toxins.

Sounds reasonable. Can you explain why "acetone breath" only happens to some of the faster, and never (AFAIK) more than once per fast, or other than in the beginning? If it was as simple as you describe, it should be very consistent or completely random. p.s: I don't see anyone mentioning toxins before you did

I think it depends on how much glucose and carbohydrates you're getting in your diet. Your body needs a minimum level to survive (eg. for brain function) and if it doesn't get it, it converts fat. So if you're on a low carb diet, but getting at least that bare minimum, you won't get ketosis. Something like that, anyway.

You were the one who started it:

> your body is finally getting rid of some stuff it should have gotten rid of

Sounds like woo-woo toxin theory to me. There are fat-soluble toxins, but I doubt they'd be enough to make you sick or smell bad.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#126

Post by beagle3 »

anthonyb wrote: post #125
beagle3 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds reasonable. Can you explain why "acetone breath" only happens to some of the faster, and never (AFAIK) more than once per fast, or other than in the beginning? If it was as simple as you describe, it should be very consistent or completely random. p.s: I don't see anyone mentioning toxins before you did

I think it depends on how much glucose and carbohydrates you're getting in your diet. Your body needs a minimum level to survive (eg. for brain function) and if it doesn't get it, it converts fat. So if you're on a low carb diet, but getting at least that bare minimum, you won't get ketosis. Something like that, anyway. You were the one who started it: > your body is finally getting rid of some stuff it should have g…

> I think it depends on how much glucose and carbohydrates you're getting in your diet.

Let me rephrase the question, as apparently it wasn't clear:

Most instances of fasting (specific time + specific instance) do not get acetone breath at all.

Some instances of fasting do get acetone breath, but if they do, it's usually only for a couple of days near the beginning of the fast (usually starting around 2nd day and ending before the 4th day), even if the fast goes on for 3 weeks.

Your explanation does not seem to make this dichotomy possible - it seems to imply an all-or-nothing situation (for a specific instance). Can you extend your description to accommodate this observation? [Note: based on personally collected set of anecdotes - I couldn't find any rigorous collection of this data]

> Sounds like woo-woo toxin theory to me.

I specifically avoided "toxins" in this reply (but not in others) because toxin theory is not well defined, and can thus easily be ridiculed to death. If you define it more properly, (e.g. caffeine "detox"), it is exactly as described, it does make you feel sick. Technically, caffeine is poisonous (as is alcohol) - it's just that in small doses, we as a specie seem to like the effect it produces.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#127

Post by Jd »

beagle3 wrote: post #107
Jd wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Up to two weeks at a time of a total (water only) fast? I've done this before, but it was quite difficult to maintain in the midst of work pressures and I'm curious to know how you manage it.

(not parent poster here, but here's my advice): Drink lots of water. When you feel like you _must_ eat right now (rarely happens after day two), drink a liter of water, and go for a short 5 minute walk. Also, add a few drops of freshly squeezed lemon juice to your water. The availability of flavor is often enough to get you through the hard 5 minutes (and after day two, it is rarely more than 5 minutes).

My experience is that even with lots of water you get serious muscle fatigue starting on day 4, and major dizzy spells everytime that you sit down/stand up. Also, the body seems to go into something of a hibernation mode and want more sleep. Besides those factors, I'd say I've managed reasonably well, and I think you could continue to work a desk job just fine -- but the inability to move quickly will kill any exercise patterns you have, or, potentially, the ability to do much more than 5 minute walks. It also makes it far more difficult to get out of bed in the morning.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#128

Post by jacques_chester »

lrs wrote: post #87
ramblerman wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Humans are funny creatures. To believe on the one hand a god laid down these rules, and then in the same thought think "Well I bet he didn't think of this loophole"

I remember having this same thought when I learned about the existence of "Islamic finance." Apparently, Islam has a strong doctrinal prohibition against charging interest, and there's an entire thriving sector of Islamic law and business dedicated to structuring transactions in ways that don't technically charge interest but still yield a return on principal. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_banking This reminds…

My understanding is that a generous portion of Rabbinic legal theory is about tapdancing around the Mosaic law.

Because most observant jews would not, I can only assume, want their children to be stoned to death for giving them a bit of cheek. Or have to be beaten up because they shaved. And so on.

What strikes me odd about biblical law is how little of it is devoted to elucidating the big questions. Such as: what about the corner cases to the Ten Commandments? Is killing in a war forbidden? What about self-defence? And so on.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#129

Post by jacques_chester »

jperras wrote: post #80
primodemus wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you detail your diet and exercise routine? I'm new to intermittent fasting and could use a little bit of advise.

Sure. It's incredibly simple, even if there are a lot of concepts to grasp. Diet: The macro-nutrient decomposition I tend to follow can be calculated for your bodyweight, height and level of physical activity here: http://www.1percentedge.com/ifcalc/ . Note that your level of physical activity is most likely sedentary, even if you plan on exercising. The higher levels are for people who have physically demanding day…

Fittitor, I take it?

Re: Fasting & Programming

#130

Post by _pius »

pessimizer wrote: post #101
_pius wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, one can use intermittent fasting to lose weight, but weight-loss usually only kicks in after 2-3 weeks. Citation needed. I personally know people who've lost weight long term with quite brief periods of intermittent fasting.

I think he's saying after 2-3 weeks of intermittent fasting, not fasting for 2-3 weeks at a time intermittently. Anecdote alert, but I started doing alternate day fasting after I read the study, then 22 hour a day fasts after I read that people were having results with that. Went from 235 to 185 in 2 years (6' tall, fairly large build.) I'm not strict, and I go off it whenever I'm bored or severely tempted. I count a…

I think he's saying after 2-3 weeks of intermittent fasting, not fasting for 2-3 weeks at a time intermittently.

Yup, I got that and I'm challenging it.

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