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Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

reuters.com

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Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#81

Post by kccqzy »

jfengel wrote: post #8
londons_explore wrote: post #5

The article really focusses on range loss when cold, but as far as I can see that isn't really true. The reality is there is lots of range loss when using the cabin heater, which obviously one is most likely to do when cold. All modern Tesla's use heat pumps for cabin heating, which ~halves the range loss, but it's still substantial.

Does the heater really use all that much energy? A home space heater is something on the order of 1 kW, which is a fraction of a percent of what is needed to move the car.

When I floor my non-Tesla EV, I can see an instantaneous power consumption of 80kW. That's when flooring it. A smoother drive is more like 10kW.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#82

Post by DSMan195276 »

ajross wrote: post #34
gleenn wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know some of the lithium-sodium batteries behave differently now but my Model Y yells at me whenever I charge above 80% or go below 20%, saying it's bad for the battery. Not exactly inspiring if it causes more wear unless you sacrifice 40% of the range.

Where's the sacrifice? Just charge it to 100% before you leave for a 200+ mile trip, there's even a setting in your app to make that happen automatically (it'll start charging at e.g. 2am or whatever is needed for your departure time). Did you gas up your car every time you drove back from work? No, right? So why complain that the car doesn't sit at 100% all the time in your garage? Seems like a silly complaint to me…

The difference is that I can fill my gas tank to 100% in a few minutes almost anywhere, no planning is necessary.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#83

Post by Extropy_ »

corey_moncure wrote: post #59

This nonsense again. My 2020 S has a lifetime Wh/Mi of ~260. When the battery was new it was 96 kWh, that's 369 miles. And I floor that sucker all the time for fun, blast the stereo, and run the A/C constantly. Luggage rack on the roof. At the end of the day, I've never had a real problem with the range. I definitely don't feel lied to. I wouldn't trade it for any other car in the world.

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Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#84

Post by hedora »

jvanderbot wrote: post #63
sashank_1509 wrote: post #10

I have a model 3 (from 2023), that is rated 270 miles. I can get at max 120 miles, more like 90 miles from it. My drive to work involves going steeply uphill, not very cold. The only reason I don’t care is I have free office charging. If I didn’t I would be pissed by the range I observe. Also Tesla servicing is famously bad, and the way the employees treat service requests (as described in the article) explains a lot

Slightly more nuanced: the "range"/battery level listed constantly is always bunk. When I enter a destination the final battery level is very accurate. This counts in cold weather or hot, with terrain effects or not. Sometimes even weather. It's quite good and I imagine there's some data driven process from past performance of the vehicle. So, if you plan to test drive a Tesla, evaluate its range this way. If you're…

Counterpoint:

Our BMW i3 gets EPA range on my round trip commute in the summer. It starts at the top of a mountain with a “100%” (actually 90% according to reverse engineering) battery (a tesla couldn’t regen in that situation, the bmw can).

It can be as low as 80% of EPA range with the heat pump cranked up in low 30F’s weather.

I’ve carefully measured two other EVs (not Tesla) on that route. One gets 110% of EPA, but can’t regen at 100% (so, it is similar to the BMW model without the hard 90% charge cap). The other gets EPA in the winter and does not have a heat pump.

FWIW, Tesla drivers that live up here complain about bogus range estimates.

I agree with the “type in destination and let the computer estimate” approach. That works well on all three cars, despite the mountains.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#85

Post by misiti3780 »

sashank_1509 wrote: post #10

I have a model 3 (from 2023), that is rated 270 miles. I can get at max 120 miles, more like 90 miles from it. My drive to work involves going steeply uphill, not very cold. The only reason I don’t care is I have free office charging. If I didn’t I would be pissed by the range I observe. Also Tesla servicing is famously bad, and the way the employees treat service requests (as described in the article) explains a lot

i have a model s 2022 and get 250 miles going 80 miles/hour.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#86

Post by elif »

Having road tripped from Florida to Washington and back in a big circle around the country, it is my firm belief that every single person complaining about the range estimates in a Tesla is speeding.

By altering my driving style, I can get more range than the estimate. It's extremely predictable and accurate, to the point where I can notice the power drain from the self driving computers/cameras, arrive at the next supercharger at exactly the 3% I aim for, etc.

There was a point in my road trip when I was on top of a mountain, and it said I would reach the next charger 100km away with 20km of range remaining, but I was only at 90km at the time. I made it with 17km of range remaining.

The estimates are really good and useful if you don't speed.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#88

Post by [deleted] »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #15
sashank_1509 wrote: post #10

I have a model 3 (from 2023), that is rated 270 miles. I can get at max 120 miles, more like 90 miles from it. My drive to work involves going steeply uphill, not very cold. The only reason I don’t care is I have free office charging. If I didn’t I would be pissed by the range I observe. Also Tesla servicing is famously bad, and the way the employees treat service requests (as described in the article) explains a lot

what's the mileage like when you take into account the downhill return trip? Unless your commute is uphill both ways through the snow :)

[deleted]

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#89

Post by ejoso »

elif wrote: post #86

Having road tripped from Florida to Washington and back in a big circle around the country, it is my firm belief that every single person complaining about the range estimates in a Tesla is speeding. By altering my driving style, I can get more range than the estimate. It's extremely predictable and accurate, to the point where I can notice the power drain from the self driving computers/cameras, arrive at the next s…

Makes me wonder how it is stated. Normal driving conditions for many (most?) drivers is faster than the posted speed limit.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#90

Post by mvdtnz »

elif wrote: post #86

Having road tripped from Florida to Washington and back in a big circle around the country, it is my firm belief that every single person complaining about the range estimates in a Tesla is speeding. By altering my driving style, I can get more range than the estimate. It's extremely predictable and accurate, to the point where I can notice the power drain from the self driving computers/cameras, arrive at the next s…

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