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I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

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Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#231
post #160
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In all of these posts I fail to see how this is engineering anymore. It seems like we are one step away from taking ourselves out of the picture completely.

I don’t write binaries, assembly, or C. If I don’t have to write an application, I’m okay with that. I still have to write the requirements, design, and acceptance criteria. I still have to gather the requirements from stakeholders, figure out why those will or will not work, provision infra, figure out how to glue said infra together, test and observe and debug the whole thing, get feedback from stakeholders… I have…

I have to say that I am worried that, by taking myself out of the loop for the 99%, I'm going to get worse at the 1% of things that occasionally fall into my lap because the LLM can't seem to do them. I think software engineering is a skill that is "use it or lose it", like many others.

There's also the question of whether I will enjoy my craft if it is reduced to, say, mostly being a business analyst and requirements gatherer. Though the people paying me probably don't care very much about that question.

Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#232
This is very far from my experience. It's been impressive on a few things but as of now I'm on day 3 of trying to get it to fix an issue in an open source library I maintain that I haven't had time to deal with. I'm in an endless loop where it keeps having the same epiphany about the root cause, then it implements a "fix", then tries to verify via a test script, then when it runs into difficulty it keeps adding workarounds to the test script. I can't get it focused on the fact that it's acting on behalf of the library author and that hacking the test script has no value.

I am not disposed to AI skepticism. I'd love it if a tool existed that worked as this guy claims. Claude Code is the best tool of its type that I've worked with but I'd put it at "on balance a time-saver in a lot of cases, way more trouble than it's worth in many others".

Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#233
post #225
post #40

A single tweet with lots of analogy, with no screenshot/screen recording/code examples whatsoever. These are just words. Are we just discussing programming based on vibe?

I think the interest has more to do with who is doing the tweeting, don't you think?

Reminder: "appeal to authority" is a classical logical fallacy.

For me, I don't know this person, which means that all the words are completely meaningless.

Which is exactly the point.

Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#234
post #115

I tried it on a small Django app and was not impressed in the end. It looks like it’s doing a lot, and at first I was very impressed, but after a while I realized that when it ran into a problem it kept on trying nonworking strategies even though it had tried them before and I had added to claude.md instructions to keep track of strategies and not reuse failing ones. It was able to make a little progress, but not get…

LLMs seem to work a lot better with statically typed languages where the compiler can give feedback.

Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#236
I do not know how to code, nothing beyond the simplest things but I am obsessed with AI development. Several month’s ago I decided to see if Claude could do the work for me.

My test was to create a tower defense game that would run in a web browser. It took me about eight prompts, each time refining it, including agreeing to the suggesting that Claude recommended and seeing Claude agree with me on the bugs that I pointed out.

It was mind blowing. It’s not pretty at all but is recognizable as a TD game. I thanked Claude and said that was enough and Claude signed off as well saying, well if you’re going to continue to refine it, do these four things. I was really stunned.

Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#237
post #124
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if it's real that person interviewed at least one candidate per day last year. Idk what kind of engineering role in what kind of org where you even do that.

When I've had an open req for my team at a California tech company I've had days where I would interview (remotely) 2-3 candidates in a single day, several days a week for several weeks straight. It's not impossible to interview 100 people in a few months at that rate.

So... do you really think you were doing it right?

Sorry this is a little harsh, but how do you get anywhere near 100 people before realizing the approach must be horribly flawed, and devising and implementing a better one? Surely it behooves you to not waste your employer's time, your own time, and the time of all those people you're interviewing (mostly pointlessly).

Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#238
post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, I've been hearing about this issue that programmers have on HN a lot. But I'm in the more 'bad programmer/hacker' camp and think that LLMs are amazing and really helpful. I know that one can post a link to the chat history. Can you do that for an example that you are comfortable sharing? I know that it may not be possible though or very time consuming. What I'm trying to get at is: I suck at programming, I know…

>and think that LLMs are amazing and really helpful Respectively, are you understanding what it produces or do you think that's its amazing because it produces something, that 'maybe' works. Here's an e.g. I was just futzing with. I did a refactor of my code (typescript) and my test code broke (vitest) and for some reason it said 'mockResolvedValue()' is not a function. I've done this a gazillion times. I allowed it…

Yeah, so I'm a 'hacker' (MIT definition here). I've only taken a single class in javascript with Sun based workstations about 20 years ago now (god, I'm old). I hated it.

All my work now is in python and SQL now and though I've watched a lot of youtube videos and plunked at StackOverFlow for ~15 years, I've never had formal education in either language. Like, it takes me about as long to set up the libraries and dependancies in python as it does to write my code. My formal job titles have never had 'programmer' in them.

My code, as such, is just to get something done. Mostly this is hardware interfacing stuff, but a little software too. I've had my code get passed up the chain and incorporated into codebases, but that's only happened a handful of times. The vast majority of the code I write is never seen by others. My code hasn't had to be maintainable as I've never really had to maintain it for more than 5 years max. I've used git on projects before, but I don't really see the need these days. The largest program I've written is ~1M lines of code. Most code is about 100 lines long now. I almost always know what 'working' means, in that I know the output that I want to see (again, mostly working in hardware). I almost never run tests of the code.

I've had the same issues you have had with LLMs, where they get stuck and I have to try to restart the process. Usually this happens to me in about 20 back and forths. I'm mostly just pasting relevant code snippets and the errors back into the LLM for a while until things work for me. Again, I know what 'working' looks like from the start.

Typically, I'll start the session with an LLM by telling it the problem I have, what I want the code skeleton to look like, and then what I want the output to look like. Then it will give the psuedo code, then I walk it through each portion of the psuedo code. Then I get to errors and debugging. Usually about half of this is just libraries and versions in python. Then, I get to the errors of the code itself. I can typically find what line of code is causing the error just from the terminal outputs. I'll talk with the LLM about that line of code, trying to understand it from the error. Then, on to the next error. Repeat that process until I get the working output I desire. I'm never expecting the right code out of the first LLM interaction, but I am expecting (and seeing) that the time it takes to get to working code is faster.

The time it would usually take me to get through all this before LLMs was about 2 weeks of work (~80 hours) per project. Now it takes me about half a day (~4 hours), and it's getting faster.

I'm not in the camp of thinking that AI is going to take my job. I am in the camp of thinking that AI is going to finally let me burn down the list of things that we really need to do around here.

Thank you for the reply!

Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#239

It seems the original poster hasn't extensively tried various AI coding assistants like Cursor or Windsurf. Just a quick heads-up based on my recent experience with agent-based AI: while it's comfortable and efficient 90% of the time, the remaining 10% can lead to extremely painful debugging experiences. In my view, the optimal scenarios for using LLM coding assistants are: - Architectural discussions, effectively re…

> extremely painful debugging experiences. I'd claim that if you're debugging the code - or even looking at it for that matter - that you're using AI tools the wrong way.

Congratulations. You allow the AI to make some new subroutine, and you immediately commit and merge the changes to your system. You run it, and it executes without throwing any immediate errors.

The business domain is far more nuanced and complex, and your flimsy "does it compile" test for the logic doesn't even begin to cover the necessary gamut of the input domain which you as the expert might have otherwise noticed had you performed even a cursory analysis of the LLM generated code before blindly accepting it.

Nice to know that I'm going to be indefinitely employed fixing this kind of stuff for decades to come...

Re: I've been using Claude Code for a couple of days

#240
post #26

I must be the dumbest "prompt engineer" ever, each time I ask an AI to fix or even worse, create something from scratch it rarely returns the right answer and when asked for modification it will struggle even more. All the incredible performance and success stories always come from these Twitter posts, I do find value in asking simple but tedious task like a small refactor or generate commands, but this "AI takes the…

I think it's probably the difference between "code" and "programming". An LLM can produce code and if you're willing to surrender to the LLMs version of whatever it is you ask for, then you can have a great and productive time. If you're opinionated about programming, LLMs fall short. Most people (software engineers, developers, whatever) are not "programmers" they're "coders" which is why they have a positive impres…

This surrendering to the LLM has been going around a lot lately. I can only guess it is from people that haven't tried it very much themselves but love to repeat experiences from other people.
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