The article doesn't actually explain why . It claims that they don't work and supplies statistical evidence. But why don't they work? I've only really seen speculation...
Have you ever been laid off?
Yes. And your point being ...?
Layoffs Don't Work
451–460 of 801 posts
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#452Earlier quoted context omitted.
Its not that the market is saturated, its that a lot of incompetent ex googlers are interviewing now. People usually have a pretty good idea they can't do their job. They find a niche where a manager is not paying attention, or they can obfuscate and take credit for others work, etc. These people don't usually job hop, the interviews are way too hard and then they are very unlikely to find another long term safe nich…
There's also the "we can only pay a third of what Google paid you..." and given two candidates that interview equally well, one is former Google and appeared to be making $300k and another is from somewhere where they were making $70k before... I'd argue for the $70k person. They are less likely to have experienced lifestyle inflation and looking at this position as a "slumming it until they can get a job making $300…
In part true, for sure.
Personally when I left Google and interviewed elsewhere I made clear to potential employers two major things:
1. I never expected to be paid "Google level" money again. I was nowhere near high up in the pay tier there, but it was still almost twice what local shops were paying, at times (depending on how RSUs worked out, etc.)
Google can pay what it can because of the ads firehose, and it was actually, more than anything, a strategy used to deprive the competition of talent.
2. I never actually liked the Google internal culture, so although I was there for 10 years I was constantly aware of the things that I didn't like and the things I would not be trying to bring over to future gigs. And I had 10+ years work experience before Google. Which didn't serve me well while I was inside Google, but definitely has afterwards.
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#453Real talk here, and I'm sorry for being "that guy" Why do tech workers get so wrapped around the axle of layoffs when most people are in a chronic state of tech job hopping? I know multiple people who have worked their entire career thus far without ever staying at a place for more than 3 or 4 years. Some no more than two. Tech job culture is practically a mono culture with "hop jobs" being a hallmark. From an employ…
I cannot speak for layoffs in all industries ever, but I agree with your assessment of layoffs in big tech from personal experiences. I have way too many “lifer” friends in big tech who are deadly scared of layoffs and job hopping. They are also the ones who rarely got promoted and havent had a significant pay bump pretty much ever. On another hand, half my team at a big tech company got laid off back at the start of…
> It seems like the heavity majority of those stressed about layoffs in big tech are lifers and those who are chronically averse to and dread the interview process.
Not helped by the fact a lot of interview processes - unless you can rely on word-of-mouth and the corporate structure allows for shortcuts - are byzantine, maddening and/or don't have much relations to the work one will be doing afterwards. No fuck you I'm in for a sysop/cloud position, I won't waste my time doing Fizzbuzz. Give me a laptop with internet and an actual work task if you want to judge my competence.
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#454Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, just cutting people across the company tends to be bad. Restructuring aka cutting programs and the people working on them has fewer downsides.
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There’s plenty of studies showing the downsides. It’s expensive, results in dramatic reductions in efficiency, etc.
Widespread layoffs are a sign management has majorly fucked up.
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#455Real talk here, and I'm sorry for being "that guy" Why do tech workers get so wrapped around the axle of layoffs when most people are in a chronic state of tech job hopping? I know multiple people who have worked their entire career thus far without ever staying at a place for more than 3 or 4 years. Some no more than two. Tech job culture is practically a mono culture with "hop jobs" being a hallmark. From an employ…
The average tenure of an employee at HP is 6.6 years (source: Google AI) to pick a company that may be outside your bubble. And the lifelong career holding older employee at a legacy enterprise tech company is the kind of worker who is most adversely affected by an unexpected return to the job seeking pool.
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#456Earlier quoted context omitted.
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That's a pretty weird and heartless thing to say. Having children is not a vice that deserves to be judged anymore than not having kids is. I could enumerate why fewer kids is bad for our collective future as a whole, but I won't, because the decision to have kids is a personal choice. Also, having kids is generally not the difference between having to work or not—most people have to work for a living regardless of f…
You can view what I wrote whatever way you want, but I stand by it and don't think it was heartless at all. I think not having children is actually more heartful and caring than having children.
Look, out of all the people who come into this world, how many people can we say were a net positive for this planet? I see that you are currently at Airbnb. Great. You are lining your pockets, but I'm not sure what the net benefit to this planet is. If I have children, the chances are great that they were just resource consumers and waste producers. There are too many people on this planet, and chances are my having kids will make this problem worse. Of course, on a local scale, your children will add love to your life, you will help them out financially, they will live at home with their parents as adults, etc. This is not being selfless. You are helping your progeny which is, ultimately, selfish. What is truly selfless is to meaningfully help someone who has no connection to you. Fight for the poor, support countries that are being terrorized by aggressor countries, adopt a shelter animal, etc. That is truly selfless. Having kids--selfish. Look at Elon Musk and his 10+ kids.
> the decision to have kids is a personal choice.
And I choose not to burden the world with my own children. I've had numerous exchange students, adopted shelter animals, and I'm volunteering at a local shelter. I'm not under any illusion that my life here is going to be a net positive for the planet, but I am trying really hard. Having children, with the traditional notions about it that you regurgitated, is a vice when you consider that we are reaching our planet's capacity for supporting all of us. Ruining other planets such as Mars, I don't feel is a morally acceptable choice.
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#457Real talk here, and I'm sorry for being "that guy" Why do tech workers get so wrapped around the axle of layoffs when most people are in a chronic state of tech job hopping? I know multiple people who have worked their entire career thus far without ever staying at a place for more than 3 or 4 years. Some no more than two. Tech job culture is practically a mono culture with "hop jobs" being a hallmark. From an employ…
Tech is a huge field. If you work in big tech or well-known companies, it is common to job-hop. If you're at something more established, traditional, or mid-sized, you'll probably find lifers.
Additionally, I think fewer people are job-hopping considering the market is so competitive. I would expect new grads to start staying at their first job for longer, too.
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#458Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Somebody who is universally hated by their co-workers How many times have we seen a company fire whoever they consider "dead weight" but keep the universally hated guy because he's a 10x rockstar whatever?
A 10x person who brings down 20 others to a small fraction of their potential and causes other rockstars to leave is still net-negative. Good management understands this. (And I'm not sure why I'm downvoted for this. Nothing about that should be controversial?)
https://www.freecodecamp.org/news/we-fired-our-top-talent-be...
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15474893 (2017) (133 points | 130 comments)
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#459Real talk here, and I'm sorry for being "that guy" Why do tech workers get so wrapped around the axle of layoffs when most people are in a chronic state of tech job hopping? I know multiple people who have worked their entire career thus far without ever staying at a place for more than 3 or 4 years. Some no more than two. Tech job culture is practically a mono culture with "hop jobs" being a hallmark. From an employ…
2 way street. you say "it's laying off a bunch of people who were gonna dip in 6 months to a year anyway."
to the new grad, it's "wow half my team just got laid off when the company seems to be doing fine, i guess i better not get too comfortable here"
Re: Layoffs Don't Work
#460This is a terrible opinion piece. Layoffs do work. Cutting hours does not work. I am always amazed how few people understand how a business operates. They think its a community organized event where there is unlimited revenue. There are a few basic accounting principles employees need to understand. It all revolves around Assets = Liabilities + Owner’s Equity. If you think otherwise, take a "Cost Accounting" course.…
Layoffs are like closing factories that don't produce, cutting products that don't sell, closing deserted retail locations, and so on. Likely bad business decisions got you there in the first place. Maybe market conditions changed. Maybe your whole company is going to fail no matter what you do. But blanket statements about what does or doesn't "work" are not very instructive.