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Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

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Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#21

Post by namshe »

jackzombie wrote: post #19
namshe wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My analysis should not be interpreted as an endorsement of the idea. I think the US annexing Canada is pretty high on the list of dumb things to do. Total waste of time and energy for very nebulously defined benefits. If I put on my realpolitik hat though, it makes sense why Trump & friends want Canada, same reason they want Greenland: access to the Arctic. Look at a world map and how Canada and Greenland are placed…

I just think this perspective ignores the large francophone speaking population, as well as a strong sepratist movement from witin Canada.

Good point - these could most likely be exploited as well. That's another way for the US to get there. Break up Canada. The Quebecois get to be their own mini-nation. Not sure what would happen to the Maritimes or Newfoundland. And it's not like Western Canada is uncontroversial, look how much people bag on Alberta.

The thing that would for sure not happen is Canada becoming an actual state in the US. Way too liberal for that and logistically it wouldn't make sense.

Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#22

Post by namshe »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #18
namshe wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is "here?" I think you're making a couple of shaky assumptions. You're assuming civil society will stand up to Trump. This seems increasingly unlikely to happen. Also, in the military, there are really serious consequences if you don't do what you're told. It's not the same world as the civilian world. So if an enlisted soldier gets told to suit up for a mission, they'll do it. Think of the Ukraine war. Many of…

> This mess is 100% the karma of all Americans. I strongly disagree. I did not vote for this shit show, nor did many others, and I have no control over those who did. > The people who voted for Trump, hey, say what you like about them, but at least they went to the polls. Voting to burn the place down is not a participation trophy.

I did my part and voted for Harris, I thought maybe she had a chance. I knew it was very likely that Trump would win. That said, couldn't we all have done more?

For example, Trump and Obama have a few interesting things in common. They both became President. And they both defeated Hillary Clinton in order to get there. In 2008, the real race was between the Democrats - Bush was so unpopular it didn't matter who the GOP ran, the Dems were going to take it (in my opinion that's why McCain was allowed to get the nomination). America had the chance to do something really different multiple times and put a woman in charge but it never happened. Now it will almost certainly never happen.

In terms of voting to burn the place down, I think that's really the point a lot of folks have missed. When the existing system doesn't serve you at all, why vote to preserve it? Governments have failed us, totally. Both parties have kowtowed to corporate interests for years and things like NAFTA have had the effects that were warned about in the 90s. Now we are reaping the results.

Very sad state of affairs.

Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#23

Post by muzani »

marssaxman wrote: post #4

I suppose the spy services might like to recruit them; it always helps to have operatives who are native speakers of the enemy's language.

We could always use more of them English speakers to understand the enemy's plans.

Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#24

Post by malfist »

namshe wrote: post #5

If there is a "war" between the United States and Canada it's going to be extremely short. There would not be a need to conscript anybody for it. The United States would simply roll tanks and troops across the border, making it to Ottawa in fairly short order. Canada would then surrender, and the Stars and Stripes would be raised across all the provinces and territories. From there, Canada could consider itself offic…

The war of 1812 would like to have a word with you.

Would you also have predicted the war in Ukraine the same way?

Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#25

Post by malfist »

namshe wrote: post #12
idontwantthis wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Short until Chinese and Russian drones arrive and irregular forces based in the mountains and forests begin reigning death down on American infrastructure and cities.

It doesn't seem like there's much reason for them to do that?

Your right, people don't have much of a reason to defend their country

Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#26

Post by HenryBemis »

malfist wrote: post #24
namshe wrote: post #5

If there is a "war" between the United States and Canada it's going to be extremely short. There would not be a need to conscript anybody for it. The United States would simply roll tanks and troops across the border, making it to Ottawa in fairly short order. Canada would then surrender, and the Stars and Stripes would be raised across all the provinces and territories. From there, Canada could consider itself offic…

The war of 1812 would like to have a word with you. Would you also have predicted the war in Ukraine the same way?

War in Ukraine: tanks rolled and stopped 1h outside Kiev. I have served in Artillery (EU country). I have seen what the Russian MLRS have done to Grozni some years back. Russians could have flattened Kiev in a week. I assume the move was to push Zelensky to quit. When they saw that this is not happening (the gamble didn't pay out) they fell back to the oblasts/regions they wanted to 'obtain'. This way they avoided a bloodbath (DDG's AI tells me Kiev had approx 2.9m population in 2022). Also if they would have flattened the capital (and killed or maimed 2m civilians in the process) then any 'moral justifications' Russians had would be eliminated. Also most (everyday people) in Russia feel Ukrainians are like brothers to them and they wouldn't forgive/forget Vlad the bloodsucker.

War of 1812 vs today: There are very few countries that have been in wars non-stop for decades. Yes, it's the USA. Maybe they don't call it "war with X country" but once you got military and they walk on foreign soil, packing guns, killing locals, yeah.. that's war alright (plus missiles, plus artillery, plus drones, plus warplanes, plus battleships, plus aircraft carriers). So imho the only country who is R-E-A-D-Y for war within a minute is the USA. Canada has Trudeau, and policemen wearing red, and horses, and snow. Sorry.. no chance. (I am leaving nukes aside as they guarantee M.A.D.)

Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#27

Post by more_corn »

namshe wrote: post #5

If there is a "war" between the United States and Canada it's going to be extremely short. There would not be a need to conscript anybody for it. The United States would simply roll tanks and troops across the border, making it to Ottawa in fairly short order. Canada would then surrender, and the Stars and Stripes would be raised across all the provinces and territories. From there, Canada could consider itself offic…

I cannot fucking believe we have been reduced to discussing this.

Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#28

Post by throwaway494932 »

namshe wrote: post #16
_zetk wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

My analysis should not be interpreted as an endorsement of the idea. I think the US annexing Canada is pretty high on the list of dumb things to do. Total waste of time and energy for very nebulously defined benefits. If I put on my realpolitik hat though, it makes sense why Trump & friends want Canada, same reason they want Greenland: access to the Arctic. Look at a world map and how Canada and Greenland are placed…

> Greenland leaves the Danish Realm

> Greenland becomes sovereign nation

Greenlanders don't want to become part of the USA afaik, but they know that in the current situation becoming independent means being invaded, sooner or later, by the USA, Russia or China, so I think that the scenario of Greenland trying to become a sovereign nation is less likely now.

As for Canada, although there are a number of Trump supporters that foam at the idea of invading their neighbor, I think that the invasion would be deeply unpopular (a number of people voted for Trump because he was supposed to stop the wars, not start new ones), especially if the Canadian population offer some kind of resistance although who knows, it is just a matter of enough propaganda...

Re: Ask HN: Can dual citizens be conscripted in case of war between US and Canada?

#30

Post by throwaway494932 »

namshe wrote: post #5

If there is a "war" between the United States and Canada it's going to be extremely short. There would not be a need to conscript anybody for it. The United States would simply roll tanks and troops across the border, making it to Ottawa in fairly short order. Canada would then surrender, and the Stars and Stripes would be raised across all the provinces and territories. From there, Canada could consider itself offic…

Once Canada is annexed, the fun (insurgency) will start.

Former Canadian citizen will be US citizen with the right to buy weapons, AR-15 and grenade launchers included.

Police and out of duty soldiers will be mowed down in random places all over the country. Martial law may be declared. People's freedom of movement will be restricted. Economy will take a bad turn.

Imagine IRA (Ireland), ETA (Spain) or PKK (Turkey) but with legal ability to get a lot of deadly weapons. I don't think Americans are ready for this.

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