Do you have a secret? • Hacker News Board

Re: Do you have a secret?

#71

Post by alanh » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 9:15 PM UTC

tomku wrote: post #31

alanh wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> calls page mindless FUD when in fact there are specific examples cited on page > doesn’t back up own claims of FUD Hello?

Please explain how either of the examples (one is specific, one is not) have anything to do with CISPA. One was a traditional terrorism investigation that was horribly botched, while the other is a case in a foreign country with laws that are completely different (and much, much worse) than CISPA. Both qualify as FUD because their factual relevancy is extremely low, while their shock value is high. Their only use on…

> Their only use on the page is to scare visitors into going "Oh my god, that could happen to me!" so that they tell all their friends about all these terrible things that the evil gubmint is going to do if we all don't oppose CISPA.

Sounds relevant to me.

They’re just taking a big picture approach here, not focusing on CISPA. I think that’s okay.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#72

Post by vyrotek » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 9:47 PM UTC

Hmm, I'm in trouble. The new NSA Data Center in Utah is being built just down the street from my house.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#73

Post by cheez » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 9:55 PM UTC

Tangaroa wrote: post #68

Wait a minute. We're supposed to be upset that the feds took a guy's computer after they matched his fingerprints to a bomb bag used in the Madrid train bombings that killed almost 200 people? And we're supposed to believe this was ethnic harassment because "he is a muslim"? If any police anywhere find near-conclusive proof that you killed 200 people, it doesn't matter if you believe in the flying spaghetti monster.…

> Blame it on faulty software and faultier human interpretation

So you mean blame it on no one but a man's life gets destroyed.

And you wonder why they get away with murder...

Re: Do you have a secret?

#74

Post by mattmaroon » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 10:03 PM UTC

I really don't like propaganda. I don't need you trying to whip me into hysteria. Just tell me what the CISPA does that you think is so bad and let me decide.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#75

Post by illuminate » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 10:17 PM UTC

malandrew wrote: post #59

jrockway wrote: post #56

Brandon Mayfield was arrested as a material witness, not as a suspect. The problem here is the increasing use of material witness warrants to arrest people suspected of a crime, rather than actually getting an arrest warrant. According to Wikipedia, "Ensuing lawsuits have resulted in a formal apology from the U.S. government and a $2 million settlement." I'll be honest: I feel like I'm being swindled by doyouhaveasec…

The sad part is that the people we have to convince that these laws are a bad idea will only be swayed by emotion. It's emotion that convinced them to support bills like this and it is going to take an appeal to emotion to convince them otherwise. It sucks to admit that, but it's how many humans work.

"the people we have to convince that these laws are a bad idea will only be swayed by emotion"

While ridding yourself of the core of supporters turned off by campaigns based on more emotion than fact?

Re: Do you have a secret?

#76

Post by sliverstorm » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 10:21 PM UTC

mattmaroon wrote: post #74

I really don't like propaganda. I don't need you trying to whip me into hysteria. Just tell me what the CISPA does that you think is so bad and let me decide.

let me decide

I don't think you understand how modern politics work.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#77

Post by sliverstorm » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 10:22 PM UTC

cheez wrote: post #73

Tangaroa wrote: post #68

Wait a minute. We're supposed to be upset that the feds took a guy's computer after they matched his fingerprints to a bomb bag used in the Madrid train bombings that killed almost 200 people? And we're supposed to believe this was ethnic harassment because "he is a muslim"? If any police anywhere find near-conclusive proof that you killed 200 people, it doesn't matter if you believe in the flying spaghetti monster.…

> Blame it on faulty software and faultier human interpretation So you mean blame it on no one but a man's life gets destroyed. And you wonder why they get away with murder...

Something bad happens, and the first thing on your mind is, "We have to blame this on somebody!"

And you wonder why America is mocked as such a litigious country...

Re: Do you have a secret?

#78

Post by sliverstorm » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 10:25 PM UTC

debacle wrote: post #13

This is just creating a database of informed CISPA dissenters. Wake up sheeple! On a more serious note, this could have been presented much better. This gave me the same feeling as that semi-attractive girl in college stepping into your personal space to tell you all about how unjust mandated meal plans are.

Your first remark cuts right to my amusement at the real tinfoil hatters. 'Cause you know, if I thought every government and every corporation was conspiring against me, I sure wouldn't let them know I knew, let alone make a public spectacle of myself.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#79

Post by sliverstorm » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 10:26 PM UTC

alan_cx wrote: post #60

untog wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you think elections are? I realise that sounds sarcastic, but really- we have a democratic system for a reason. No, it doesn't work perfectly, but whole point is that they are representatives of us.

Democratic? Really? Are we still kidding yourselves that we have some sort of democracy? Oh man. Representatives of "us"? Oh, you donated millions to an election fund, right? No? Oh, OK then, you're a lobbyist, backed by millions? No. Ah well, they aint representing you then. We are sold government in the same way tobacco companies sold tobacco in the past. Lies, misrepresentation, half truths, and attacks on the oth…

So what do you propose instead? Direct vote on every issue?

Re: Do you have a secret?

#80

Post by malandrew » Wed, Aug 01, 2012, 10:32 PM UTC

illuminate wrote: post #75

malandrew wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sad part is that the people we have to convince that these laws are a bad idea will only be swayed by emotion. It's emotion that convinced them to support bills like this and it is going to take an appeal to emotion to convince them otherwise. It sucks to admit that, but it's how many humans work.

"the people we have to convince that these laws are a bad idea will only be swayed by emotion" While ridding yourself of the core of supporters turned off by campaigns based on more emotion than fact?

Fine. Those people will instead support the EFF. There is a "market" for this advocacy media and producing material supporting a viewpoint but in different formats appealing to difference audiences is called market segmentation.

Just because people are turned off by this advertising, doesn't mean they will be turned off from supporting this cause. They'll still support it, but via other means, such as the EFF.