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Do you have a secret?

doyouhaveasecret.org

51–60 of 107 posts

Re: Do you have a secret?

#51

Instead of always trying to get the government to listen to its citizens, wouldn't it be better if it were required to seek OUR approval for new legislation?

What do you think elections are?

I realise that sounds sarcastic, but really- we have a democratic system for a reason. No, it doesn't work perfectly, but whole point is that they are representatives of us.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#54
post #21
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's nice rhetoric, but when you disregard the truth in order to keep up in the arms race of lies that you claim the other side started, you become as reprehensible as them.

Telling lies and X is not equally as bad as telling lies and not X. EX: Where X is killing people. 'Smoking cigarettes makes you popular smoking cigarettes makes you unpopular.'

That's a particularly bad example, since the idea that cigarettes will make you unpopular will be a transparent falsehood to the target audience, and might cause them to doubt you when you say that cigarettes will kill them.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#56
Brandon Mayfield was arrested as a material witness, not as a suspect. The problem here is the increasing use of material witness warrants to arrest people suspected of a crime, rather than actually getting an arrest warrant.

According to Wikipedia, "Ensuing lawsuits have resulted in a formal apology from the U.S. government and a $2 million settlement."

I'll be honest: I feel like I'm being swindled by doyouhaveasecret.org. Instead of presenting me with facts, they're relying on emotion and hearsay. And that's just as bad as the government wanting to search my laptop. The EFF's campaign is a more mature: https://cyberspying.eff.org/

Re: Do you have a secret?

#57
post #46
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, yet it's also frustrating to live in a world where deceptive and emotional manipulation works because most people aren't that good at recognizing it and counteracting it. Do you just gnash your teeth and stick to your moral high ground while everything burns? Or do you "play the game", and use manipulation to achieve the moral good? Personally, I think I tend to do the former. When I get the relatives' chain…

Sometimes you can correct the ignorance, sometime you best ignore it. But in the end even Starfleet had Section 35. The world is dirty and sometimes it is better to play dirty than to lose. I am not sure if this is one of those times though.

did you mean section 31? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Section_31

Re: Do you have a secret?

#58
post #6
post #3

Huh? What does any of this have to do with CISPA? There are good reasons to oppose CISPA. You shouldn't appreciate people trying to manipulate you into opposing it.

There are good reasons to oppose CISPA. You shouldn't appreciate people trying to manipulate you into opposing it. This is something that really annoys me. It's incredibly frustrating to see people argue "on my side", but using reasons that are based almost entirely on FUD and hyperbole. It undermines that entire side of the argument, because people who aren't already on your side assume that if you had valid reasons…

Ideological war versus honest discourse. It comes down to which of these you believe is the engine of progress.

If it's war, then naturally all's fair in the name of winning the cause. If not, you probably believe that a cause is not a cause worth believing in if you have to betray it to make it happen, that the only way is through honest discourse and "being the change", even if it means social evolution.

The generally horrible state of politics is the direct result of too many people following the cynical view, that it's war. Another manifestation of our sad human tendency to favor the short-term over the long.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#59

Brandon Mayfield was arrested as a material witness, not as a suspect. The problem here is the increasing use of material witness warrants to arrest people suspected of a crime, rather than actually getting an arrest warrant. According to Wikipedia, "Ensuing lawsuits have resulted in a formal apology from the U.S. government and a $2 million settlement." I'll be honest: I feel like I'm being swindled by doyouhaveasec…

The sad part is that the people we have to convince that these laws are a bad idea will only be swayed by emotion. It's emotion that convinced them to support bills like this and it is going to take an appeal to emotion to convince them otherwise.

It sucks to admit that, but it's how many humans work.

Re: Do you have a secret?

#60
post #51

Instead of always trying to get the government to listen to its citizens, wouldn't it be better if it were required to seek OUR approval for new legislation?

What do you think elections are? I realise that sounds sarcastic, but really- we have a democratic system for a reason. No, it doesn't work perfectly, but whole point is that they are representatives of us.

Democratic? Really? Are we still kidding yourselves that we have some sort of democracy? Oh man.

Representatives of "us"? Oh, you donated millions to an election fund, right? No? Oh, OK then, you're a lobbyist, backed by millions? No. Ah well, they aint representing you then.

We are sold government in the same way tobacco companies sold tobacco in the past. Lies, misrepresentation, half truths, and attacks on the other brand. And because advertising is so powerful, yes it is, you think you are part of it. You're not, you are pawns. Necessary to get the "important" pieces in to position, but in the end, sacrificed at will for their greater good. Your jobs, homes, mortgages, businesses, financial health, health, all there for the taking so that those at the top can get rich, or as the banks have shown, survive and keep their bonuses. Its a filthy pyramid scheme, that we are conned in to supporting.

Sorry, democracy is a myth.

I assume its worse in the US.

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