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Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

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Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#11

Post by throwaway48476 »

hot_gril wrote: post #4
14 wrote: post #2

Very cool to see people still working on hacking the 360. I used the RGH on my 360 years ago. Was really fun back in the day going through all the cat and mouse that went on. A soft mod would be cool as the RGH does require soldering some very tiny wires to some very tiny pads and I remember seeing posts of many people lifting pads trying to do this mod. But in the end I had a perfect install on my 360 and would boot…

Do the people who hack 360s also know how to prevent them from inevitably red-ringing? Cause that's the biggest thing discouraging me from buying another (my other 2 went red).

The red ring is caused by underfill that is too soft that let's the solder bumps break. It's a BGA packaging problem and there's no fix.

Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#12

Post by throwaway48476 »

hart_russell wrote: post #8
pogue wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not every model of the 360 will inevitably red ring. Those were typically only the "fat" models and there are some fixes to prevent it from happening. It usually just involves changing to some better quality thermal paste & reflowing the board. https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Xbox+360+Red+Ring+of+Death+Fix+...

This video does a deep dive on the subject: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24KbVf1AD1c He suggests that all of the fat models will eventually red ring due to being stress tested at the factory. Not sure how true that is.

RIP Felix has a much better video that explains the cause of the failure.

Factory stress isn't the cause. It was a bad design.

Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#13

Post by mouse_ »

whalesalad wrote: post #10
mouse_ wrote: post #9

I wish there was somewhere I could toss cash into a softmod bounty.

at this point is there any reason to use xb360 hardware? emulation on modern hardware has gotta be substantially better

Xbox 360 emulation is still really bad for most games, despite what some YouTubers would have you believe. But let's say in a few years it does become substantially better. There's still:

• Nostalgia

• Authenticity

• Compatibility

• Preservation

• Cost of entry

Even if 360 emulation does become practical, a 360 will still be cheaper than any gaming PC capable of playing those games.

Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#14

Post by jsheard »

nolok wrote: post #3
14 wrote: post #2

Very cool to see people still working on hacking the 360. I used the RGH on my 360 years ago. Was really fun back in the day going through all the cat and mouse that went on. A soft mod would be cool as the RGH does require soldering some very tiny wires to some very tiny pads and I remember seeing posts of many people lifting pads trying to do this mod. But in the end I had a perfect install on my 360 and would boot…

Ah, I remember I had one of the first series where they forgot to remove the JTAG pins

Xbox security has certainly come a long way since the OG Xbox, which featured a pin header that may as well have had "insert modchip here" printed next to it.

Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#15

Post by rpcope1 »

hot_gril wrote: post #4
14 wrote: post #2

Very cool to see people still working on hacking the 360. I used the RGH on my 360 years ago. Was really fun back in the day going through all the cat and mouse that went on. A soft mod would be cool as the RGH does require soldering some very tiny wires to some very tiny pads and I remember seeing posts of many people lifting pads trying to do this mod. But in the end I had a perfect install on my 360 and would boot…

Do the people who hack 360s also know how to prevent them from inevitably red-ringing? Cause that's the biggest thing discouraging me from buying another (my other 2 went red).

I've not modded my 360E, and it was probably one of the very last 360s built, but I've never had any problems with it, still play on it, and my understanding is there are fewer and less dire problems with it than the prior 360 and S.

Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#17

Post by hot_gril »

whalesalad wrote: post #10
mouse_ wrote: post #9

I wish there was somewhere I could toss cash into a softmod bounty.

at this point is there any reason to use xb360 hardware? emulation on modern hardware has gotta be substantially better

Xbox 360 and PS3 emulators are still borderline unusable on my new-ish PC. They're slow, glitchy, and/or hard to set up. Related to what the other commenter said, anyone who says these are good must have a lot of time to deal with it, whereas I just want the equivalent of sticking the disc into the console.

GameCube is the newest thing I've had a decent experience emulating, and even that isn't 100% unless it's Melee with the Slippi optimizations (n.b. did not try DS or Switch).

Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#18

Post by Novosell »

throwaway48476 wrote: post #11
hot_gril wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do the people who hack 360s also know how to prevent them from inevitably red-ringing? Cause that's the biggest thing discouraging me from buying another (my other 2 went red).

The red ring is caused by underfill that is too soft that let's the solder bumps break. It's a BGA packaging problem and there's no fix.

Sure you're not thinking of the PS3 or did both of them actually suffer the same issue?

Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#19

Post by Retr0id »

mouse_ wrote: post #9

I wish there was somewhere I could toss cash into a softmod bounty.

Assigning dollar values to this kind of work gets messy, fast.

Imagine if someone iterated on the exploit presented in the article so that it became a persistent "softmod" - who gets the funds?

Bounties also discourage open collaboration. For example, if person A has the first half an exploit chain and person B has the second, they're each incentivised to keep the information to themselves and try to get a full chain on their own to claim the bounty. Of course, this assumes they're financially motivated - but if they're not there's no point in the bounty in the first place.

Re: Hacking the Xbox 360 Hypervisor Part 2: The Bad Update Exploit

#20

Post by 6SixTy »

Novosell wrote: post #18
throwaway48476 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The red ring is caused by underfill that is too soft that let's the solder bumps break. It's a BGA packaging problem and there's no fix.

Sure you're not thinking of the PS3 or did both of them actually suffer the same issue?

Both of them experience the same issue. Though it's a yellow light instead of the ring on the Xbox.
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