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China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

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Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#51
post #13

The sweet spot: Good enough at AI to make 7 figures. Not good enough to personally be a geopolitical pawn.

Apparently 7 figures is the new 6 figures...

I mean "low income" is 6 figures in the silicon valley [1]. So 6 figures really isn't much anymore.

[1] https://hoodline.com/2023/06/new-ca-income-limits-classify-s...

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#52
This reminds me of the historical period when London and Berlin were the two technology centers of the world, in intense competition to develop the next generation of math, science, and applications to military. Most scientists in one country did not read the output of the other country, although in some cases, the Danes or the Dutch would translate interesting research.

A scientist from London visiting Berlin (and vice versa) could well expect to be surveilled by the opposite country and possibly even considered a traitor by their own.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#53

Deepseek is great. What fundamentally prevents an open source coalition from producing great AI systems for everyone?

In the west, there is almost no money for open source.

1. There isn't anywhere. DeepSeek is open source to salt the earth and gain ecosystem advantage. It's a ridiculously smart move that yanks the leading players back to the ground right as they're about to take off into the stratosphere.

2. Big tech has managed to profit off of open source, yet only give the pieces they want others to maintain back. None of the value pieces are open sourced. Open source authors need to start using licenses with bigger fangs. Licenses with MAU/ARR cutoffs.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#56

I wonder if given the recent "moral" loss of US, we will see a post-WW2 Soviet vs USA style defection of scientists & engineers between USA and China? When you read the reasoning of people that defected from UK/US to soviet with nuclear secrets it's kinda hard to grasp now, but back then I can definitely understand that a mix of "the soviets are not that bad" and "are we really that good?" could've made people switch…

As an EU-based employer, I'm seeing a post-WW2 soviet vs usa style defection of engineers between USA and Europe. By the way, if anyone US-based is in this situation and wants to "defect" to an EU-job, send me a message, I can help you.

What’s your take on near-term stability for American immigrants in Europe? I was looking at options for moving last year but the work visa situation seemed fairly precarious (although that’s a relative thing in comparison with what may end up happening here in the US).

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an EU-based employer, I'm seeing a post-WW2 soviet vs usa style defection of engineers between USA and Europe. By the way, if anyone US-based is in this situation and wants to "defect" to an EU-job, send me a message, I can help you.

What’s your take on near-term stability for American immigrants in Europe? I was looking at options for moving last year but the work visa situation seemed fairly precarious (although that’s a relative thing in comparison with what may end up happening here in the US).

Personally I’m pushing my (Belgian) government hard to provide a streamlined path for American immigrants, especially tech workers.

In general, it’s easy, just highly bureaucratic. If you compare to what most other countries have to go through, getting a work visa as a skilled us citizen is quick.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#58

Why does the US still allow Chinese nationals to study at its universities and work at its companies? Seems like a big risk that cutting edge research and trade secrets will go to America’s main adversary. Industrial espionage by China has a long history, and China has more valuable things to steal from America than the other way.

You'd rather they do all of the cutting edge research back in China?

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#59

I wonder if given the recent "moral" loss of US, we will see a post-WW2 Soviet vs USA style defection of scientists & engineers between USA and China? When you read the reasoning of people that defected from UK/US to soviet with nuclear secrets it's kinda hard to grasp now, but back then I can definitely understand that a mix of "the soviets are not that bad" and "are we really that good?" could've made people switch…

It's already been happening for years. Award winning faculty and scientists are fleeing US universities and institutions and setting up shop in China, often with more funding and talent available, and no McCarthyism accusations of being spies. It started officially in 2018 with the US Department of Justice's "China Initiative", which basically just allowed anyone to go on a witch hunt of Chinese and Chinese American academics. Of course, the vast majority of those cases were bogus and was just a guise for racism.

This isn't the first time. In the 1950s, the founder of Berkeley JPL, an MIT professor who was one of the forefathers of NASA and Manhattan Project contributor, and who Theodore von Karman called a generational genius, Chinese educated Qian Xuesen was humiliated with accusations of being a communist spy and given a multi-year house arrest where he couldn't work so that his knowledge would fall behind the state of the art. He was then deported, and went back to China where he created the Chinese space program entirely from scratch. In China today, he's widely known as a national hero and the "father of Chinese rocketry". If you really want your mind blown, look up his family tree and see how many Nobels and National Science Medals are related to him.

The past few years alone has seen some really high profile scientists taking their knowledge and experience with them to China. These are people who've spent 30+ years building lives here in the US, and were initially being forced out, but now are actually being lured with better pay packages and working conditions since the first wave was treated so well. It's absolutely insane.

https://www.justsecurity.org/82948/anti-asian-prejudice

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#60
post #15

No, this is just about keeping people from defecting and taking secrets / cash with them. Many Chinese people working for state controlled companies or similar (schoolteachers were one ridiculous example I think) in super mundane jobs have their passports taken away or exit bans for "national security" reasons.

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