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Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

bengarcia.dev

11–20 of 233 posts

Re: Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

#11

It’s not really hallucinating though, is it? It’s repeating a pattern in its training data, which is wrong but is presented in that training data (and by the author of this piece, but unintentionally) as being the solution to the problem. So this has more in common with an attack than a hallucination on the LLM’s part.

Not necessarily. While this may happen sometimes, fundamentally hallucinations don't stem from there being errors in the training data (with the implication that there would be no hallucinations from models trained on error-free data). Hallucinations are inherent to any "given N tokens, append a high-probability token N+1"-style model.

It's more complicated than what happens with Markov chain models but you can use them to build an intuition for what's happening.

Imagine a very simple Markov model trained on these completely factual sentences:

- "The sky is blue and clear"

- "The ocean is blue and deep"

- "Roses are red and fragrant"

When the model is asked to generate text starting with "The roses are...", it might produce: "The roses are blue and deep"

This happens not because any training sentence contained incorrect information, but because the model learned statistical patterns from the text, as opposed to developing a world model based on physical environmental references.

Re: Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

#12

It’s not really hallucinating though, is it? It’s repeating a pattern in its training data, which is wrong but is presented in that training data (and by the author of this piece, but unintentionally) as being the solution to the problem. So this has more in common with an attack than a hallucination on the LLM’s part.

So anyone can make up some random syntax/fact and post it once, and in some cases the model will take it as truth. I don't know if there's a widely agreed-on definition of "hallucination", but if this isn't one, then the distinction is meaningless imo.

Re: Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

#14

It’s not really hallucinating though, is it? It’s repeating a pattern in its training data, which is wrong but is presented in that training data (and by the author of this piece, but unintentionally) as being the solution to the problem. So this has more in common with an attack than a hallucination on the LLM’s part.

That's not true though? Even the original post that has infected LLMs says that the code does not work.

Re: Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

#16
post #6

[flagged]

Until it's got several nines, it's not trustworthy. A $3 drugstore calculator has more accuracy and reliability nines than any of today's commercial AI models and even those might not be trustworthy in a variety of situations.

There is no self awareness about accuracy when the model can not provide any kind of confidence scores. Couching all of its replies in "this is AI so double check your work" is not self awareness or even close, it's a legal disclaimer.

And as the other reply notes, are you a bot or just heavily dependent on them to get your point across?

Re: Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

#17
post #5

ChatGPT used to assure me that you can use JS dot notation to access elements in a Python dict. It also invented Redocly CLI flags that don't exist. Claude sometimes invents OpenAPI specification rules. Any time I ask anything remotely niche, LLMs are often bad.

It tried to convince me that it is possible to break out of outer loop in C++ with `break 'label` statement placed in nested loop. No such syntax exists.

Re: Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

#18
post #5

ChatGPT used to assure me that you can use JS dot notation to access elements in a Python dict. It also invented Redocly CLI flags that don't exist. Claude sometimes invents OpenAPI specification rules. Any time I ask anything remotely niche, LLMs are often bad.

Well, it makes sense. The smaller the niche, the lesser weight in the overall training loss. At the end of the day, LLMs are (literally) classifiers that assign probabilities to tokens given some previous tokens.

Re: Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

#19
post #5

ChatGPT used to assure me that you can use JS dot notation to access elements in a Python dict. It also invented Redocly CLI flags that don't exist. Claude sometimes invents OpenAPI specification rules. Any time I ask anything remotely niche, LLMs are often bad.

I once asked Perplexity (using Claude underneath) about some library functionality, which it totally fabricated.

First, I asked it to show me a link to where it got that suggestion, and it scolded me saying that asking for a source is problematic and I must be trying to discredit it.

Then after I responded to that it just said “this is what I thought a solution would look like because I couldn’t find what you were asking for.”

The sad thing is that even though this thing is wrong and wastes my time, it is still somehow preferable to the dogshit Google Search has turned into.

Re: Making o1, o3, and Sonnet 3.7 hallucinate for everyone

#20
post #9
post #5

ChatGPT used to assure me that you can use JS dot notation to access elements in a Python dict. It also invented Redocly CLI flags that don't exist. Claude sometimes invents OpenAPI specification rules. Any time I ask anything remotely niche, LLMs are often bad.

Yeah this is so common that I've already compiled a mental list of prompts to try against any new release. I haven't seen any improvement in quite a long while now, which confirms my belief that we've more or less hit the scaling wall for what the current approaches can provide. Everything new is just a microoptimization to game one of the benchmarks, but real world use has been identical or even worse for me.

I think it would be an alright (potentially good) outcome if in the short-term we don't see major progress towards AGI.

There are a lot of positive things we can do with current model abilities, especially as we make them cheaper, but they aren't at the point where they will be truly destructive (people using them to make bioweapons or employers using them to cause widespread unemployment across industries, or the far more speculative ASI takeover).

It gives society a bit of time to catch up and move in a direction where we can better avoid or mitigate the negative consequences.

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