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DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

theatlantic.com

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Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#691

Post by ToValueFunfetti »

nerdponx wrote: post #499
gattr wrote: post #451

Perhaps the whole situation will finally convince the "I don't mind, I have nothing to hide" crowd about the need to scrutinize & limit as much as reasonably possible the personal data collection and retention by government and other entities. What good are rules, statutes, checks & balances, passwords and ACLs, if at some point someone you don't like or trust can just come in "as a root" and circumvent everything?

The "I don't mind, I have nothing to hide" people are cheering this on. They don't know or care about any of the things you just said.

Do you have cause to believe "nothing to hide" is a partisan position? I'd expect that half of such people are on the left and are critical by default of the new administration. Seems to be supported by the second chart here: https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2023/10/18/how-american...

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#692

Post by renewiltord »

lucasyvas wrote: post #631
lfmunoz4 wrote: post #628

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This kind of thinking is what leads to zero progress. Also I think most people will be surprised how unless a lot of the data is compared to private sector data. I.e, in 2017 Equifax leaked data on 150 million people and no one cared (you get a free 6month credit check). That data went to foreign governments and private databases and it is easy to access on darkweb so real actual scammers and criminals have it. Milli…

What company do you work for so I can tell them to fire you for negligence? Nobody hire this person. How can you possibly disagree with this and call yourself good at your job or a technologist? What an embarrassing take. Seriously you might want to delete your post if you want to ever be employed again. Actually trying to help you here.

[flagged]

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#693

Post by scottLobster »

lfmunoz4 wrote: post #628
lucasyvas wrote: post #490

Because there are bigger fish to fry, I think people don’t appreciate the sheer cost of the system rebuild that will be required for security reasons later. There’s absolutely no telling what additional software has been installed alongside existing, or which systems have been modified that would require audit. Purging this will be an absolute fucking nightmare to the American taxpayer. This may turn into one of the…

This kind of thinking is what leads to zero progress. Also I think most people will be surprised how unless a lot of the data is compared to private sector data. I.e, in 2017 Equifax leaked data on 150 million people and no one cared (you get a free 6month credit check). That data went to foreign governments and private databases and it is easy to access on darkweb so real actual scammers and criminals have it. Milli…

By your logic we should just do away with cybersecurity in general. Clearly, it's all already out there so it isn't a problem!

We've already had the occasional large leak and survived, why not just leak continuously! Also leave your doors unlocked, you wouldn't want robbers to break an expensive door to get into your house, and most of your stuff isn't worth anything anyway!

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#694

Post by nyeah »

gattr wrote: post #451

Perhaps the whole situation will finally convince the "I don't mind, I have nothing to hide" crowd about the need to scrutinize & limit as much as reasonably possible the personal data collection and retention by government and other entities. What good are rules, statutes, checks & balances, passwords and ACLs, if at some point someone you don't like or trust can just come in "as a root" and circumvent everything?

I fear that only very bitter experience will convince those folks.

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#695

Post by nyeah »

nerdponx wrote: post #499
gattr wrote: post #451

Perhaps the whole situation will finally convince the "I don't mind, I have nothing to hide" crowd about the need to scrutinize & limit as much as reasonably possible the personal data collection and retention by government and other entities. What good are rules, statutes, checks & balances, passwords and ACLs, if at some point someone you don't like or trust can just come in "as a root" and circumvent everything?

The "I don't mind, I have nothing to hide" people are cheering this on. They don't know or care about any of the things you just said.

They will care when they personally get badly screwed.

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#696

Post by whymeogod »

Gormo wrote: post #649
eecc wrote: post #201

IMHO it's a bit of a shame that the productivity and efficiency gains that computing and cybernetics can bring to complex systems -- including government -- are always tainted and currently championed by anti-social elites that use them to break apart these collective machines. Bureaucracies are a common good, and it should be in everyone's interest to apply state-of-the-art system engineering to make them as valuabl…

> Bureaucracies are a common good Bureaucracies are just organizations of humans, who have the same motivations, biases, and incentives ans everyone else, everywhere else in society. They're not a "common good", they're just people, and because they have de jure authority over certain domains, they need be subject to oversight and accountability if we're to trust them. Bureaucracies often have perverse incentives, ul…

> Bureaucracies are just organizations of humans, who have the same motivations, biases, and incentives ans everyone else, everywhere else in society

No, the biases and incentives are different in government than in business. Yes, there are biases and incentives, but they are different.

The main attraction of government work is the ability to serve your country, and to be rewarded by taking actions which produce (what you believe is) long-term social good.

Your belief that an adversarial relation between forces of government leads to a favorable equilibrium is indeed the basis of the US constitution, and the very thing which DOGE/Trump are attacking with such force.

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#697

Post by 28304283409234 »

borgster wrote: post #216

The President is the head of the executive branch. If _anyone_ in the executive branch has access to information, it feels like the presidents office should too. Why is this hard to accept?

He is not a monarch. The core principles of a well functioning democracy include that there are multiple, balanced powers and that none of the powers can overrule the other too much. It is cumbersome by design, because the other path leads to dictatorships.

That was the whole basis of your constitution.

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#698

Post by misiti3780 »

This is great news for anyone paying taxes in the US. People really underestimate how incompetent the federal work force really is. Not everyone of course. But I contracted with the DOD for six years and you legit could have fired half the federal employees. They didnt do shit all day and it sounds like it's gotten way worse since COVID allowed these people to work from home.

I seriously want a real, non-politically based argument on why we shouldnt be trying to 1. find fraud 2. fire 10-20% of these people immediately

Imagine what we can do in 2025 by applying LLM search to all of the federal paperwork!

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#699

Post by whymeogod »

theshrike79 wrote: post #336
justin66 wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> IMHO it's a bit of a shame that the productivity and efficiency gains that computing and cybernetics can bring to complex systems They're just firing people at random, they haven't discovered any innovative new way to make systems more efficient. ("at random" is a bit generous and ignores the retaliation against political adversaries)

It's not "at random". Every shuttered department had been investigating one of Elmo's properties...

To add to hrow0101c's list

USAID was investigating Starlink

Consumer Protection Bureau has numerous investigations open vs Musky companies

Treasury is involved in regulating Muskys X for Finance thing

Re: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data

#700

Post by JBSay »

CyrsBel wrote: post #530
lucasyvas wrote: post #490

Because there are bigger fish to fry, I think people don’t appreciate the sheer cost of the system rebuild that will be required for security reasons later. There’s absolutely no telling what additional software has been installed alongside existing, or which systems have been modified that would require audit. Purging this will be an absolute fucking nightmare to the American taxpayer. This may turn into one of the…

Yes. Even if DOGE is operating without any ill intent, and I don't think they have ill intent, the possibility of errors alone is massive and they need to slow down. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/trum...

Most of government agencies are errors themselves
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