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You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

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Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#21

Post by calebpeterson »

namdnay wrote: post #19
calebpeterson wrote: post #8

I once had a manager that was fond of saying: > Experience is what you get when you don’t have any. The only better experience than working on a legacy codebase is working on a greenfield project long enough to watch it become legacy and see the good and bad consequences of past decisions.

And the only better experience than "working on a greenfield project long enough to watch it become legacy and see the good and bad consequences of past decisions" is working on a second greenfield project long enough to see that drastically overcompensating for all the bad things from the first one is not the right solution either :)

So true!

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#22

Post by callc »

kreco wrote: post #11
tayo42 wrote: post #6

Is there a significant amount of people not working on code that already exists? That's like the total opposite of my experience

In one of my past job, for some reasons I was the only one diving into legacy 12+ years old code. The other members kept producing new code and debugging new code. Disregarding of whether it's fair or not, there was a kind of balance that kept the boat floating. I left since then and it wouldn't surprise me if the legacy was being rewritten from scratch (and over-engineered).

Legacy 12 year old? Try 40 - 45 year old code.

Back when people mandated an 80 character line width because their CRT monitors only had so much resolution

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#23

Post by calebpeterson »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #15
calebpeterson wrote: post #8

I once had a manager that was fond of saying: > Experience is what you get when you don’t have any. The only better experience than working on a legacy codebase is working on a greenfield project long enough to watch it become legacy and see the good and bad consequences of past decisions.

Especially when they're your decisions, decisions you pushed for and felt very good about at the time.

Yep!

There is no teacher quite like cause and effect.

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#24

Post by fjjjrjj »

namdnay wrote: post #19
calebpeterson wrote: post #8

I once had a manager that was fond of saying: > Experience is what you get when you don’t have any. The only better experience than working on a legacy codebase is working on a greenfield project long enough to watch it become legacy and see the good and bad consequences of past decisions.

And the only better experience than "working on a greenfield project long enough to watch it become legacy and see the good and bad consequences of past decisions" is working on a second greenfield project long enough to see that drastically overcompensating for all the bad things from the first one is not the right solution either :)

And the only better experience than that is killing a new greenfield project before it gets to production because the old software was good enough and the problems were organizational in how the software was being used.

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#25

Post by moltar »

hiAndrewQuinn wrote: post #9

By this logic I've been a senior engineer since I started working!

Same here. My first job was “take this spaghetti mess and make it better”. It was an old crusty Perl CGI codebase without any framework and a ton of bad decisions.

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#26

Post by where-group-by »

I unironically like working on legacy projects. It's good to know it stood the test of time and my efforts spent on it won't be wasted, because it is unlikely to be dropped.

Of course this assumes there is a way to introduce improvements at all. Just keeping the lights on isn't as satisfying.

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#27

Post by svachalek »

calebpeterson wrote: post #8

I once had a manager that was fond of saying: > Experience is what you get when you don’t have any. The only better experience than working on a legacy codebase is working on a greenfield project long enough to watch it become legacy and see the good and bad consequences of past decisions.

"You either die a hero or you live long enough to become the villain"

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#28

Post by TeMPOraL »

calebpeterson wrote: post #23
pavel_lishin wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Especially when they're your decisions, decisions you pushed for and felt very good about at the time.

Yep! There is no teacher quite like cause and effect.

Reinforcement learning, as usual, for the win!

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#29

Post by tayo42 »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #17
tayo42 wrote: post #6

Is there a significant amount of people not working on code that already exists? That's like the total opposite of my experience

"Code that already exists" isn't necessarily the same as a "legacy project", though everyone's definition of what "legacy" means is different.

I guess, how do you define legacy then?

Re: You're not a senior engineer until you've worked on a legacy project (2023)

#30

Post by gorbachev »

namdnay wrote: post #19
calebpeterson wrote: post #8

I once had a manager that was fond of saying: > Experience is what you get when you don’t have any. The only better experience than working on a legacy codebase is working on a greenfield project long enough to watch it become legacy and see the good and bad consequences of past decisions.

And the only better experience than "working on a greenfield project long enough to watch it become legacy and see the good and bad consequences of past decisions" is working on a second greenfield project long enough to see that drastically overcompensating for all the bad things from the first one is not the right solution either :)

I keep telling people v1 of anything always sucks.

One of the tells of an inexperienced engineer I use is how much they disparage the previous team's work.

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