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iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

hollylisle.com

31–40 of 121 posts

Re: iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

#31
post #2

Do we really want our information mediated/censored by this sort of corporate behavior?

Absolutely not. This is where the line is drawn. I've grown to accept Apple's App Store policies for the sake of keeping app quality high. However, when it comes to distributing content that people actually use to learn new things and enrich their lives, there is absolutely no room for this type of policy. To anyone who is selling their books via Apple: GTFO right now.

This is the place where the line is drawn, but not when. Check https://www.google.com.br/search?sugexp=chrome,mod=4&sou...

Apple can, and will, decide what expression will be published. It's not a platform, it's more like a newspaper classified section, with bias.

Re: iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

#32
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For Kindle users that's true, which is the one and only reason I didn't buy.

You don't have to buy your kindle-books from amazon.

And you don't have to buy your iBooks books from Apple. In fact, I rarely (maybe never) have, but I prefer it's reading experience to the Kindle apps (for whatever reason). I just use Calibre to convert.

Re: iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

#34
post #23
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting thing is, traditional book publishers could do the same. Maybe they have, and we wouldn't be aware of it. My impression is that they mostly haven't and mostly wouldn't. I think Apple, Amazon et al. are particularly extractive, and they come at anything firstly from the point of view of how they can control and channel the experience, the level of focus being unique to them.

Relevant: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/books/2012/06/barnes-a... ...Barnes and Noble’s budget electronic edition of Tolstoy’s “War and Peace” had searched for and replaced all incidences of the word “kindled” (a variant of the name of Amazon’s e-reader, of course, but also a legitimate English word) with the word “Nookd.”...

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Re: iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

#35

Sad, but expected from apple. Oh well, there's apple's book suicide. B&N is already dead with its 16gb Nook with only 1gb for user content. That really only leaves Amazon or full self publishing (on your site). Interesting how the winner wins sometimes ...

Apple book suicide? Most books sold aren't self-published. This won't even dent iBooks at all. I prefer the iBookstore for a few reasons, but one is that the comments on Amazon are often filled with ranting nonsense. You can't visit a bestseller's page on Amazon without seeing tons of comments about the price of the book and how angry they are about it, while on iBooks, the comments seem to be more reasoned. I don't…

Yes, but the marketshare is minuscule. iTunes carries UR. I don't know if the iBookstore has it, but it is a novel about a Kindle. Which mentions Amazon many times. I wonder if they would apply the same policy to such a popular author ...

Re: iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

#36
I'm failing to see the big picture here. One author who provides detailed links to a competitor's site gets rejected for a book about self-publishing. It isn't like Apple is rejecting political books with which they disagree or preventing users from reading specific content on their devices. Their store just chose not to sell an item. Supermarkets aren't obligated to stock every possible variety of orange juice, nor should Apple be held to any higher of a standard.

Apple doesn't have an obligation to sell anything and everything. It's their store. They choosing to not sell something isn't "bad" -- users of Apple devices can still read whatever they want.

Acting indignant like Apple has some mandate to sell anything that anyone wants is ridiculous. If you were Coca-Cola, would you let people sell Pepsi from your machines? Of course not. Is Coke bad for choosing not to sell Pepsi? Want Pepsi? Go to a Pepsi machine.

The terms of submission for the iBooks store are pretty obvious. Having that lady's book rejected shouldn't have come as a surprise. A simple RTFM would have told her exactly what would have happened when she links to competitor's stores.

You want to play ball in Apple's park, you have to follow the rules. Disagree with the rules if you want, but don't complain when you don't follow those rules and are asked to leave.

Every few months we seem to go through this Cycle of Indignity. Usually it's because of some App Store rejection. We all piss and moan about it, but for the most part, the App Store has remained a high quality experience (and a profitable one for devs) even though occasionally someone gets offended about something or another.

Put the pitchforks away -- this isn't that big of a deal. Thousands of writers sell through the iBookstore without any problems. This lady's story is an outlier in an otherwise pleasant place. Her real problem is a lack of a decent web developer.

Re: iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

#38

I'm failing to see the big picture here. One author who provides detailed links to a competitor's site gets rejected for a book about self-publishing. It isn't like Apple is rejecting political books with which they disagree or preventing users from reading specific content on their devices. Their store just chose not to sell an item. Supermarkets aren't obligated to stock every possible variety of orange juice, nor…

In a store there is a physical lack of shelf space. Not so in an online store.

That's why people get annoyed, even though apple is clearly within its rights.

Re: iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

#39
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely not. This is where the line is drawn. I've grown to accept Apple's App Store policies for the sake of keeping app quality high. However, when it comes to distributing content that people actually use to learn new things and enrich their lives, there is absolutely no room for this type of policy. To anyone who is selling their books via Apple: GTFO right now.

This is the place where the line is drawn, but not when. Check https://www.google.com.br/search?sugexp=chrome,mod=4&sou... Apple can, and will, decide what expression will be published. It's not a platform, it's more like a newspaper classified section, with bias.

The difference to me is that they're calling this a "bookstore," and the thing that they're selling is supposed to be a new way of consuming the thing that we traditionally know as "books."

That's what I used to believe their business was.

Now, it's clear that an iBook is not a book. It is a digital material sold to people who like to consume content via their pretty and pricy devices. I agree that Apple makes it fun to consume content their way. And I'm sure that for the most part, people can still mostly absorb all the same knowledge that they would from a traditional paper book. But, this content has to be approved and modified to be consumed and therefor, it is not a book.

So the reason I am not comfortable with all this is for the reason I stated above. I was essentially tricked into believing they were selling books. Now that probably sounds extreme. But, the truth is that I am an educated "tech person" who looks at this stuff every day, and I did not think about this problem until now. The people they are trying to sell to are those in education, who are going to be raising and educating young people by reading these iBooks. When I was a kid, we were taught that books were magical and that the more we read, the more open our minds would become. In elementary school, we made us sing songs about books to make reading seem more fun and appealing.

If schools are adopting this form of content, then they are telling young people that the best way to learn things is via a model that is filtered (simply to increase Apple's profits).

Re: iBookstore rejects Holly Lisle's writing course because she mentions Amazon

#40

I'm failing to see the big picture here. One author who provides detailed links to a competitor's site gets rejected for a book about self-publishing. It isn't like Apple is rejecting political books with which they disagree or preventing users from reading specific content on their devices. Their store just chose not to sell an item. Supermarkets aren't obligated to stock every possible variety of orange juice, nor…

> Apple doesn't have an obligation to sell anything and everything. It's their store. They choosing to not sell something isn't "bad" -- users of Apple devices can still read whatever they want.

Apple has that right. And potential Apple customers has the right to say that they will not stand control freakery like that in their store.

Apple has backed down before. Like when they tried to force everybody to use Objective-C/C++ to make iOS apps.

> Acting indignant like Apple has some mandate to sell anything that anyone wants is ridiculous. If you were Coca-Cola, would you let people sell Pepsi from your machines? Of course not. Is Coke bad for choosing not to sell Pepsi? Want Pepsi? Go to a Pepsi machine.

If they want to be a general book seller, they should know they will get questioned every time they refuse to carry a book due to its content. There is no way to avoid that.

> Put the pitchforks away -- this isn't that big of a deal. Thousands of writers sell through the iBookstore without any problems. This lady's story is an outlier in an otherwise pleasant place.

What is the problem, do you think it will become a less pleasant place just from people raising questions about their policies? Why does that prospect bother you so?

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