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Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

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Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#381
Environmentalism really is just a slippery slope ideology. We have electric cars that don’t pollute and are an amazing experience… but oopsy woopsy they have tires so I guess we need to ban them too. Might as well just keep people burning diesel because the electric cars aren’t ideologically pure enough.

How about we just solve the actual problem first? The planet is burning. People used to burn coal indoors for heating, that’s way more fucking harmful than 1 micron of brake dust.

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a few ways to get the weight down. Improvements in battery chemistry, lower range trims, and simply smaller vehicles.

Would love to buy a 100km range EV with easily accessible/rentable +~300km booster batteries for the occasional long drive. I guess an occasional ICE rental could fill the gap but they often nail you on long distances

That’s like saying you want a 60HP engine that you can hot swap for a 300HP engine. They’re built into the hulls!

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do. But if you brake too agressively, they switch to friction brakes. It pays off to avoid this: more mileage, marginally lower charging expense, lower cost on brake maintenance and fewer complaints from passengers.

"It pays off to avoid this: more mileage, marginally lower charging expense, lower cost on brake maintenance and fewer complaints from passengers." Regen braking wears the hell out of your battery. That few hundred you saved on brake changes just cost you a tens of thousands of dollars on a premature battery replacement.

Most EVs will not use regenerative braking when the battery is over 80% which is where the damage mostly happens

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#384

Having lived next to a semi-main street through a smallish California coastal city without much rain it is pretty eye opening how much black dirt and junk just coat everything next to the road. Walk down the street and touch a bush or any plant leaf and get a nice black hand in the process. The plants are covered, parked cars get covered and the inside of my apartment was covered. It wasn’t until I moved out that I s…

Wouldn't this be very well mitigated by the use of an air purifier?

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always assumed EVs use regenerative braking as much as possible on their own.

They do. But if you brake too agressively, they switch to friction brakes. It pays off to avoid this: more mileage, marginally lower charging expense, lower cost on brake maintenance and fewer complaints from passengers.

Apparently you need to use the friction brakes now and then so they don’t degrade early, which could be a safety issue. I think as long as you’re using the car frequently it’s incredibly unlikely to be a problem though.

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that not all cars correctly illuminate the brake lights when regenerative braking is in effect.

This is why Tesla’s are best selling EVs. Only cynics and idiots buy anything else. Either way I am deeply sorry for them.

Thanks for your deep sorrow for this idiotic cynical nissan leaf owner. Love you too

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed about SUV culture. American consumers demand giant cars. It is a safety arms race and also cultural preference.

I'm not convinced of the "safety". SUVs (and larger cars in general) have higher risk of roll over. Not to mention you're a bigger target on the road; how often are accidents head-on collisions compared to a corner clip that sends the other spinning. Don't majority of "accidents" happen in parking lots? Last year I was driving a lot of different cars for work. I was really excited once when I got a RAV4 because I've…

I would prefer to live in a world where all the cars are small.

Taking your example of a corner clip, the larger car would fare better; the smaller car will spin more. There is no better description than "arms race." I understand there are edge cases with rollover, etc. but the first rule is mass.

I suppose the second rule is where between the two cars the force is absorbed. Ideally bumper-to-bumper. Modified lifted trucks ought to be banned as far as I'm concerned; it defeats the factory design that had to comply with laws.

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#388
post #379
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d appreciate it if there was an attempt to actually engage here, this is hardly the gotcha you might think. Most fatalities of motorcycles are due to collisions with cars, not other bikes nor pedestrians. Diligence won’t save you if a driver unexpectedly swerves into you. Undoubtedly there are stupid people and people who are more likely to take more risks will be more likely to engage in motorcycle riding; creatin…

I used to be an EMT in the US. I also was an avid motorcycle rider for many, many years. And an avid bicycle rider for even longer. It is dramatically easier to screw yourself up on bicycles and motorcycles than cars. It’s frankly shocking how stupid someone can be in a modern car and survive. It doesn’t require another car to kill someone on a motorcycle or bicycle, but the squids tend to filter themselves out prett…

my perspective is someone where the city has been largely built for cycling, which leads to less deaths overall.

Population of Malmo is actually higher than Orlando, FL for example.

Yet, for Skåne (the region where Malmo is; pop: 1,421,781), 25 traffic deaths were recorded in the year 2019[0].

173 road deaths were recorded in Orange County (where Orlando is; pop: 1,429,908), during the same period.[1]

That’s a difference of 7x, and Skåne is one of the largest regions in the country, many places are car dependent - yet the major change is that urban areas are sufficiently dense so can be cycled (even during cold climates) and that there’s dedicated infrastructure for doing so, which eases the traffic burden too.

[0]: https://www.transportstyrelsen.se/globalassets/global/press/...

[1]: https://www.flhealthcharts.gov/ChartsReports/rdPage.aspx?rdR...

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#389
post #57
post #50

I'm conflicted about declaring something as "more harmful" in such a narrow context. The article says that human cells react worse to dust from modern brakes than to exhaust or even dust from asbestos brakes. But this ignores the impact of exhaust on city pollution, or the hazards of asbestos production process, etc. I guess this only tells us that dust from modern brakes can be dangerous and we should keep an eye on…

PM2.5 is pretty bad. Implicated in exacerbating childhood asthma, heart disease, diabetes, and basically a ton of other issues. Proximity to large roads (like US Interstates) is known to be a bit higher in PM2.5.

My point exactly; no need to compare brake dust to other things for it to sound bad.

Re: Dust from car brakes more harmful than exhaust, study finds

#390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also in the UK and I certainly subscribe to r/fuckcars as I'm a keen cyclist and never got around to learning to drive. I find it annoying that media outlets (BBC - I'm looking mainly at you!) will refer to EVs as being car-shaped and then, as you said, demonise e-bikes by lumping them in with the illegal e-motorbikes (see the recent Panorama program for a clear case of not making clear the distinction between e-moto…

> However, if we get as many people to use e-bikes or e-scooters, then the size and weight issues pretty much disappear. I still don't understand how they expect to solve the occupant safety issue though. Cars travel at high speeds but have crumple zones and airbags. E-bikes travel at the same speeds but if you crash, you die. And 2-wheeled vehicles are easier to crash. The fatality rate for motorcycles is astonishin…

> I still don't understand how they expect to solve the occupant safety issue though.

What issue? I would regularly go 50km/h down hills on my road bike. That was completely my choice and if I came off I'd suffer the consequences.

The problem isn't the occupants. Nobody is forced to travel at high speeds (except on motorways). The problem is the people around and the environment. I definitely would not ever go that fast in town, even down a hill, because it's generally not safe for the people around me.

The problem with cars is the huge imbalance of power. Every car has the capability of killing or disabling you. But you can't disable them. As far as I know, carrying a portable EMP device is neither practical nor legal. Two wheeled vehicles don't exhibit this imbalance of power, not even motorbikes. I believe this is the most important reason to get rid of cars from towns.

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