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Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

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Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#41

Post by pessimizer »

andrewfelix wrote: post #39
knowtheory wrote: post #24

So, what happens in animals who swallow magnets is that on occasion, two magnets or a magnet and another object can be in different windy bits of the intestinal tract and stick together, pinching two otherwise unconnected parts of the intestine together, sometimes kinking them together sufficiently to cause a blockage, which doctors say could cause perforation of the intestine or other very bad things. So as many wil…

Other things marketed as playful or safe for kids in the US; - Bicycles (Over 500 deaths a year) - Battery powered toys (Roughly 2500 battery ingestions a year, Roughly 2% Fatality Rate) - Bottles, Pacifiers etc. (2200 ER Injuries per year)

You're being deceptive. How many deaths per bicycle, per battery, and per bottle?

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#42

Post by mturmon »

unreal37 wrote: post #33
evdawg wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the big difference is that thumb tacks are not a toy. These are a toy. They're marketed as a toy. They're given to children as a toy .

I own a set of these. They are not given to children young enough to put them in their mouth. Parents who do so are irresponsible.

I have a set too, and they are cool. I let my six-year-old play with them, because I trust her. She knows not to let her friends play with them. In the light of this suit, I'll have to reconsider that.

They are really easy to lose, and if lost, they can be picked up and swallowed by a kid, and their parent would never know. The particular danger of strong, tiny magnets is quite non-obvious (inspecting the comments here makes that clear), even spooky.

They are commonly sold at science centers, near children's toys, another indication that the marketing was done to kids, and not as just a desk toy.

I've been dreading the day one of the ones I've lost gets sucked into the vacuum...no telling how much damage it could do if it sticks onto a gear.

I'm not surprised about the suit.

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#43

Post by muyyatin »

esrauch wrote: post #30
loceng wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think we should ban knives, and hot surfaces - to protect children of course.

This is a totally ridiculous comparison. I'm not in favor of the ban, but comparing a knife (something dangerous that no sane parent would let their kid play with) to this (something less dangerous that is explicitly a toy that most parents would have no problem letting their kids play with) is ridiculous.

So if 12 parents let their children play with knives (and the children were harmed) like the 12 instances for Buckyballs, we should ban all knives?

It seems like parents ignoring warning labels on an item not marketed towards children is the main issue (I wouldn't necessarily say the magnets were less dangerous either).

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#44

Post by deliciouscoffee »

knowtheory wrote: post #24

So, what happens in animals who swallow magnets is that on occasion, two magnets or a magnet and another object can be in different windy bits of the intestinal tract and stick together, pinching two otherwise unconnected parts of the intestine together, sometimes kinking them together sufficiently to cause a blockage, which doctors say could cause perforation of the intestine or other very bad things. So as many wil…

Your last line is an excellent point and really the crux of the issue. These buckyballs are marketed as a toy and widely understood to be a toy. Just glancing at the website there's "NOT A TOY" in large font but a little further down is a quote saying "There's no better desktoy". It's not surprising that there is some confusion. People just don't associate magnets with danger and the toy-ness of this product certainly doesn't help.

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#45

Post by deliciouscoffee »

evdawg wrote: post #17
patio11 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On investigation, and somewhat surprisingly to me, it seems that medical experts legitimately believe that swallowing these particular small metal objects are worse than swallowing garden-variety small metal objects because if you swallow e.g. 5 BB pellets then you'll pass 5 BB pellets but if you swallow 5 high-powered magnets you now have one single clump o' metal which is large/heavy/sharp enough to damage your int…

I think the big difference is that thumb tacks are not a toy. These are a toy. They're marketed as a toy. They're given to children as a toy .

Even if they aren't given to children I don't think they set off the "hey this is really dangerous" alarm for a lot of people. Ideally an adult would play with these then count them all to make sure none are missing and store them out of reach of a child -- every single time with no mistakes or exceptions. Requiring that level of care kind of moves these out of the "toy" category in my mind.

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#46

Post by joshschreuder »

irq wrote: post #37
knowtheory wrote: post #24

So, what happens in animals who swallow magnets is that on occasion, two magnets or a magnet and another object can be in different windy bits of the intestinal tract and stick together, pinching two otherwise unconnected parts of the intestine together, sometimes kinking them together sufficiently to cause a blockage, which doctors say could cause perforation of the intestine or other very bad things. So as many wil…

Some animals are purposely fed magnets to improve their health. For example, the Cow Magnet: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cow_magnet

It's only one magnet though, more could span a pipe and cause a blockage or trap internal linings as described above.

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#47

Post by mistercow »

pessimizer wrote: post #40

I can't believe they waited this long. I'd be surprised if a lot of adults haven't swallowed these, too. Everybody knows that BBs and pennies pass easily, so why wouldn't you think that about magnets? It isn't like the warnings are printed on every ball, and there's nothing intuitive about their danger. Tiny, strong BB magnets can have no place in a house that ever has kids in it. It's not safe to have them in or on…

They're also both an educational and creative toy that can introduce kids to the counterintuitive ways that magnets interact, while teaching them to build things within unusual constraints. Yes, they are dangerous if swallowed, just like a lot of other things that we have around our houses all the time. Keep them out of reach of young children, sure, but this is a tiny risk that has been blown out of proportion by the media. Last year, over 1,600 kids under 6 were poisoned by household cleaners... just in Washington DC.

As for "why would you assume that you can't swallow it?", I just don't even what to say. Don't just assume that you can safely swallow shit?

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#48

Post by mistercow »

esrauch wrote: post #29
anigbrowl wrote: post #5

This is a nonsense suit. The first time we bought a box of these, one of the first things we noticed was the warning about the dangers of strong magnets and the risks of swallowing them in particular.

I think the issue is that no parent can reasonably stop their kid from swallowing these if the kid wants to; do you disagree with that? Note that every McDonalds toy that is actually perfectly safe for young kids has a swallowing/choking hazard, so it's pretty much guaranteed that people can't know that they have to take those seriously in this case.

No parent can reasonably stop their kid from drinking bleach or Drāno if the kid wants to. Should we ban those too?

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#49

Post by lambda »

deliciouscoffee wrote: post #44
knowtheory wrote: post #24

So, what happens in animals who swallow magnets is that on occasion, two magnets or a magnet and another object can be in different windy bits of the intestinal tract and stick together, pinching two otherwise unconnected parts of the intestine together, sometimes kinking them together sufficiently to cause a blockage, which doctors say could cause perforation of the intestine or other very bad things. So as many wil…

Your last line is an excellent point and really the crux of the issue. These buckyballs are marketed as a toy and widely understood to be a toy. Just glancing at the website there's "NOT A TOY" in large font but a little further down is a quote saying "There's no better desktoy". It's not surprising that there is some confusion. People just don't associate magnets with danger and the toy-ness of this product certainl…

But toys aren't necessarily for kids. There are many toys which are intended for adults. Now, in some cases they may be called things other than toys (fashion accessories, schwag, sports equipment, sex toys), but at their heart, they are toys, just toys targeted to adults, not kids. Should every one of those that's dangerous be banned because it might be mistaken for a toy for a kid? Does the fact that a vibrator or handcuffs are sold as "sex toys" mean that they should meet all of the safety guidelines for children's toys?

Or should we say, maybe, that people should just exercise better judgement themselves; that people should realize that a collection of many small round magnets that are easily lost and difficult to do anything with without some fairly fine manual dexterity probably isn't the best toy for someone who might be tempted to eat them?

Re: Feds file suit against Buckyballs, retailers ban product

#50

Post by andrewfelix »

pessimizer wrote: post #41
andrewfelix wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other things marketed as playful or safe for kids in the US; - Bicycles (Over 500 deaths a year) - Battery powered toys (Roughly 2500 battery ingestions a year, Roughly 2% Fatality Rate) - Bottles, Pacifiers etc. (2200 ER Injuries per year)

You're being deceptive. How many deaths per bicycle, per battery, and per bottle ?

You're quite right I am being somewhat deceptive to make a point. However to my knowledge there are no deaths related to Buckyballs, and the rate of ingestion is something like 0.0000048%.
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