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UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

theguardian.com

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Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#21

Post by giantg2 »

GlacierFox wrote: post #5

I've never made a bet before, on an app or in a betting shop and have no inclination to ever do so. However, in the UK I'm bombarded with gambling (bingo and 'games') advertisements on daytime TV aimed at trying to convince me it's actually in some way fun to pittle away my money. Then if I watch anything after 10pm on a UK streaming service or live advertising funded TV, I'm absolutely battered with endless gambling…

It's pretty rampant in the US too.

I don't think a little gambling is bad, but the endless ads are a huge problem. They should really make all advertising of commonly addictive stuff banned - gambling, alcohol, etc. They should also do a better job of educating kids in school about the dangers and tricks.

They were going you $100+ to open an account, or doing a deposit match up to $1k here. It's exactly what drug dealers do to get people hooked or scam artists to con someone - here's a free taste, or a deal that's too good to pass up.

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#22

Post by locallost »

beejiu wrote: post #15
FerretFred wrote: post #2

The government will never intervene while the UK gambling industry contributes so much money. In 2022, the total figure was about £14 billion. See https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/report/annual-report-a...

£14 billion is the industry revenue. Gambling taxes to the state are £3.3 billion. Gambling harms are costed at £1.77 billion, of which £1 billion is death from suicide and £0.5 billion for depression. Those costs are conservative estimates (the government "expect that the true costs are higher because the lack of evidence meant that it was not possible to cost all types of harms or the wider harms to individuals or…

Automotive industry. If you factor in climate change, then fossil fuel industry first and foremost, but actually quite a lot of them.

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#23

Post by beejiu »

echoangle wrote: post #18
spencerflem wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's absolutely true and not hard to look up

Can you find a link for me if it’s not hard? https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/63bc25b4d3bf7... This looks fairly official and cites 1.05 to 1.77 billion £ in societal cost on page 6. That’s less than 14 billion £.

Even if you accept those figures (and the report itself says they are underestimates), in what other industry do we allow 10% of your topline revenue to directly result in suicide and depression?

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#24

Post by giantg2 »

locallost wrote: post #22
beejiu wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

£14 billion is the industry revenue. Gambling taxes to the state are £3.3 billion. Gambling harms are costed at £1.77 billion, of which £1 billion is death from suicide and £0.5 billion for depression. Those costs are conservative estimates (the government "expect that the true costs are higher because the lack of evidence meant that it was not possible to cost all types of harms or the wider harms to individuals or…

Automotive industry. If you factor in climate change, then fossil fuel industry first and foremost, but actually quite a lot of them.

Really all of them if we're bringing in the environmental concerns. Even the "green" companies due to their inputs and methods.

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#25

Post by DrBazza »

cm2012 wrote: post #3

I work in advertising and defend tracking, targeting, Meta, etc all the time as largely harmless. But I think one exception is when they promote products which are bad. Tobacco ads are already banned - gambling should 100% be a banned ad category. So should mobile apps that are basically gambling in disguise.

> I work in advertising and defend tracking, targeting, Meta, etc all the time as largely harmless.

Perhaps tell that to one of my friends that has a shopping addiction. He buys endless amounts of running gear, and then resells it, basically burning thousands of pounds every year. His phone does nothing but show more and more running gear adverts. We've told him to stop but he reckons he doesn't have a problem. No runner needs 30 pairs of trainers a year, or 10 rucksacks etc.

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#26

Post by giantg2 »

beejiu wrote: post #23
echoangle wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you find a link for me if it’s not hard? https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/63bc25b4d3bf7... This looks fairly official and cites 1.05 to 1.77 billion £ in societal cost on page 6. That’s less than 14 billion £.

Even if you accept those figures (and the report itself says they are underestimates), in what other industry do we allow 10% of your topline revenue to directly result in suicide and depression?

Alcohol? Probably others.

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#27

Post by spencerflem »

echoangle wrote: post #18
spencerflem wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's absolutely true and not hard to look up

Can you find a link for me if it’s not hard? https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/63bc25b4d3bf7... This looks fairly official and cites 1.05 to 1.77 billion £ in societal cost on page 6. That’s less than 14 billion £.

That links not bad, though like beiju said, it does mention

"Looking from a wider societal perspective, there are a range of costs that have not, or have only been partially quantified here (such as crime, education, cultural harms, impacts on relationships and wider impacts on the families of gamblers). For these reasons, we believe the figures of £412.9 million and £635 to £1,355.5 million to be an underestimate of the true scale of the total economic burden associated with harmful gambling."

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#28

Post by echoangle »

spencerflem wrote: post #27
echoangle wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you find a link for me if it’s not hard? https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/63bc25b4d3bf7... This looks fairly official and cites 1.05 to 1.77 billion £ in societal cost on page 6. That’s less than 14 billion £.

That links not bad, though like beiju said, it does mention "Looking from a wider societal perspective, there are a range of costs that have not, or have only been partially quantified here (such as crime, education, cultural harms, impacts on relationships and wider impacts on the families of gamblers). For these reasons, we believe the figures of £412.9 million and £635 to £1,355.5 million to be an underestimate of…

Ok, but „we’re estimating about 1.5 billion but it’s likely more“ is far from „it’s absolutely more that 14 billion and that’s easy to find“. I’m not even saying I don’t believe that it’s more, it could be, but I don’t think there’s any proof of that.

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#29

Post by giantg2 »

ninkendo wrote: post #16
cm2012 wrote: post #3

I work in advertising and defend tracking, targeting, Meta, etc all the time as largely harmless. But I think one exception is when they promote products which are bad. Tobacco ads are already banned - gambling should 100% be a banned ad category. So should mobile apps that are basically gambling in disguise.

I live in a Midwest state that allows gambling completely unrestricted, including apps where you just give a credit card and press a slot machine button and (inevitably) lose all your money. I also watch the local news each morning as part of my morning routine. It’s utterly ridiculous how many gambling ads are on tv now. Like outside of election season with political ads, it feels like 9 in 10 ads are for some gambl…

Not sure of your location, but it seems many rural areas have turned completely to vice. It seems every other new business is a smoke shop, dispensary, bar, tattoo parlor, etc. Many other businesses are shutting down, like bowling alleys, hobby related stores, etc. And gambling has been added to some that stick around, including stuff like "skills based" games.

But the most obviously bad change I've seen is the drugs. I think they're also partially responsible for the popularity of gambling due to hopelessness and how bad things have gotten in some areas.

Edit: I should add that the other 50% of business seem to be fast food and dollar stores.

Re: UK betting giant's unlawful marketing kept suicidal gambler hooked

#30

Post by echoangle »

beejiu wrote: post #23
echoangle wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you find a link for me if it’s not hard? https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/63bc25b4d3bf7... This looks fairly official and cites 1.05 to 1.77 billion £ in societal cost on page 6. That’s less than 14 billion £.

Even if you accept those figures (and the report itself says they are underestimates), in what other industry do we allow 10% of your topline revenue to directly result in suicide and depression?

Not suicide and depression but the tobacco industry is probably similar. I wouldn’t go as far as claiming 10% but sugar is probably not very healthy for society either.

And I’m not even saying that gambling is fine or should be supported, I was just sceptical of the claim that the damages exceed the income.

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