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Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

cnbc.com

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Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#91

Post by ModernMech »

llm_nerd wrote: post #67
dutchbookmaker wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The figures I have seen in a trade war with Canada is Canada causes a -.2% hit to US GDP while Canada gets a -2% hit. That is not going to work for Canada. These aren't abuses of power though. We just largely got use to the president not trying to do all that much. Obama issued 275 executive orders and Franklin Roosevelt issued 3721. Calvin Coolidge issued 1203. I think all the presidents during my lifetime combined…

>That is not going to work for Canada. Is it going to shut up shop and close down? What does "not going to work" mean? The US is the one who chose this path, not Canada, and Canada is going to do what needs to be done for the situation the US forced it into. And FWIW, many Americans are a little in denial about how fragile your entire economy and social order is, and how little it takes to topple it. The impact of a…

> If you think it isn't an abuse for your president to lie to you to have powers that he doesn't have, you have lowered your standards to corrupt banana republic levels.

By not prosecuting George W Bush and his lies about WMDs in Iraq as crimes, we set the stage for the lies today about Canada to be excused as business as usual. Which… yeah it kind of is, and that’s what makes USA dangerous.

In fact, many of the people who preached unity and bygones back then are cheer leading the lies against Canada today. So the pst is coming back to haunt us.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#92

Post by Terr_ »

_DeadFred_ wrote: post #30
toomuchtodo wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said Canada will respond by placing 25% counter-tariffs on C$155 billion ($107 billion) worth of American-made products. That will include tariffs on C$30 billion worth as of Tuesday, with the rest coming later in February, to allow Canadian companies to adjust their supply chains and find alternatives. > American beer, wine, food and appliances will be among the many items subject to…

Canada is specifically going after goods from red states. Imagine if every nation Trump goes after targeted the same states that Canada has? They can't devastate the entire USA but they can absolutely devastate a few US states if they play smart and work together. Especially poorer red states.

Especially states/interests related to the impeachment process.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#95

Post by Terr_ »

_DeadFred_ wrote: post #32
peeters wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Every American service -- Netflix, Disney, Prime, Apple services -- need to have enormous tariffs applied. We can handle without them, and every enabler of this insanity needs to suffer. No need to wait for tariffs. I started cancelling all American services today. Netflix and Prime were first. I will not send money to a country that has declared an unwarranted trade war on my country. And it truly is unwarranted.…

Please get your government to work with Mexico and China to put tariffs on specific red states. You can absolutely devastate the economy of a few states, especially poorer red states and other states Senators would then think twice before voting in favor of things that could turn those tariffs to their state.

> twice about voting in favor

Given that all this (and there's a whole lotta other extra this) is coming straight out of the White House without any legislative votes, the future vote that is going to matter involves impeachment and removal from office.

That should guide how other countries' decide to structure their retaliation.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#96

Post by Terr_ »

rsynnott wrote: post #58
ConspiracyFact wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I may have worded that wrong. Articles say that they will hurt American consumers and don’t address the actual purpose of the tariffs, which is to put political pressure on their targets. If the tariffs didn’t have at least some chance of succeeding at this, the targets wouldn’t be talking about retaliation.

> If the tariffs didn’t have at least some chance of succeeding at this, the targets wouldn’t be talking about retaliation. … Eh? Retaliation is an absolutely standard part of a trade war; it virtually always happens, and, unfortunately, it can’t really be foregone. Like, people are talking about retaliatory tariffs because that is _how it works_; that is what always happens and really must happen.

Does anybody else have hazy childhood memories of those kids who would hit others but throw a bewildered crying tantrum when they were hit back in direct response?

One of them's setting policy right now.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#97

Post by toomuchtodo »

Terr_ wrote: post #95
_DeadFred_ wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please get your government to work with Mexico and China to put tariffs on specific red states. You can absolutely devastate the economy of a few states, especially poorer red states and other states Senators would then think twice before voting in favor of things that could turn those tariffs to their state.

> twice about voting in favor Given that all this (and there's a whole lotta other extra this ) is coming straight out of the White House without any legislative votes, the future vote that is going to matter involves impeachment and removal from office. That should guide how other countries' decide to structure their retaliation.

Impeachment is unlikely because the GOP has to kowtow to Trump to survive him and his base. The path is to beat down red states and their electorates with tariffs. The direct economic harm is the only lever to pull, and therefore a coalition of nation states is needed to specifically target red states collectively.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#98

Post by tokioyoyo »

School-Cotton wrote: post #87
tokioyoyo wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cost of living in Canada has been untenable for the past decade. The choice is to bend the knee or suffer more with the hopes you’ll at least go down with pride. I have no idea how the hell the government across the border got their citizens to start hating on us within a couple of weeks.

They didn’t. The vast majority of Americans don’t hate Canadians. You don’t need a popular referendum to set tariffs, the president can just do it. One of the many downsides of electing a crazy person as president.

Fair, apologies for having a knee-jerk reaction to it. It just sucks to scroll a tiny bit on forums and get bombarded with pure hate. I understand that it doesn’t represent the majority, but makes you scratch your head and think why so many level headed people are willing to throw away trust that was built throughout decades. Like I get the whole America First approach, and understand the desire to build out the manufacturing locally… but is it worth it to turn away all of your allies and make them get closer with the actual super power that wants to dethrone you?

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#99

Post by dismalaf »

ModernMech wrote: post #88
dismalaf wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

The demand now seems to be that Canada join the US as the 51st state. This isn’t about trade.

The average American makes nearly 60% more than the average Canadian... I doubt many would object.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#100

Post by halostatue »

laverya wrote: post #79
dutchbookmaker wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really understand what the end game is with Canada here. For Mexico, it seems more like a prod for social policy on immigration and fentanyl. I listened to Trudeau yesterday and he isn't even able to get a hold of Trump right now, something that seems just insane. I am just not sure that is true though that this is a disaster for the US. How much can China afford to fight back here with the state of their eco…

What I've been seeing is people saying that Canada is the source for most fentanyl coming into the US, not Mexico. (This is also the US's stated reason for tariffs on Canada)

I don't know where you've seen that, because not even the professional liars at the DEA claim that.
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