Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

cnbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 169 posts

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#61

Post by Ekaros »

Gunnerhead wrote: post #45
Grosvenor wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could start a joint nuclear program with Ukraine. Canada has the Canadian shield which is rich in Uranium. Both Canada and Ukraine get nukes (Ukraine has a bridge that needs blowing up), Ukraine gets safety, Canada gets huge reputation gains in trade with Ukraine. NB: Ukraine will be the fastest growing western economy post war for at least a decade or two.

Nukes for everyone yay! Hey Georgia is also under Russian threat, why don’t they also get a nuke or two? Then maybe their neighbor Armenia will think to themselves “why not me, I’m also under threat by an ex-Soviet country”? Then maybe Azerbaijan, then Turkey, then Saudi Arabia, everyone gets a nuke, I freaking love it! Then maybe other countries that got invaded by a bigger power like maybe Vietnam? Iraq? Why not!

Is it time finally to give Cuba some nuclear weapons.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#62

Post by Ekaros »

llm_nerd wrote: post #40
1over137 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I bet this concludes with a free trade treaty between China, Canada, and Mexico. Well Canada & Mexico already have NAFTA 2.0. I doubt there will be one between Canada and China, they have frosty relations.

Canada is a member of CPTPP, which was the replacement for TPP that Trump backed the US out of. Canada really doesn't have a bad relationship with China. We had a tiff previously when we arrested Meng Wanzhou on behalf of the US, and in return China arrested the Canadian "two Michaels"[1] and both countries used Canada as a pawn. [1] I turns out they were, in effect, intelligence operatives in a sense, and China actu…

Also who if not Chinese from China would keep pumping in money to Canadian real estate market... Have to keep inflating that bubble.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#63

Post by dismalaf »

3vidence wrote: post #20

Why is the American government so hell bent on destroying its own economy? The biggest things they import for Canada aren't even manufactured goods but raw materials. The only way to avoid the T tarrif at that point is to import from a different country but there are tarrifs there as well. What is even the end game here? Make China the new biggest game in town?

[flagged]

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#64

Post by dismalaf »

Marsymars wrote: post #17
llm_nerd wrote: post #3

Canada was specifically warned not to retaliate in any manner, which is basically an acknowledgement that Canada has some powerful levers. This is farcical and of course Canada is going to retaliate. The $450B of American goods sold to Canada is going to collapse. The F35 purchase will be cancelled. Various other projects with the US will be abandoned. Oil will be export tariffed. Every American service -- Netflix, D…

> Every American service -- Netflix, Disney, Prime, Apple services -- need to have enormous tariffs applied. No tariffs required, just suspend their copyright protection and spin up some free government-run streaming video servers.

Unfortunately we already have a few Canadian run streaming services and they're utter shit... As in constant buffering, won't cast to TVs properly, that sort of thing.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#65

Post by dutchbookmaker »

TheAlchemist wrote: post #6

What's the plan here ? Tariff war with all main trading partners ? According to Trump EU tariffs are coming in soon. US can win any tariff war against a single country. They maybe could win against China or EU or Canada / Mexico alone. But all of them at once ? This is going to be a disaster for the US. Because of current sky-high stock market valuations, US thinks it's the only game in town. We will soon see if it's…

I don't really understand what the end game is with Canada here.

For Mexico, it seems more like a prod for social policy on immigration and fentanyl.

I listened to Trudeau yesterday and he isn't even able to get a hold of Trump right now, something that seems just insane.

I am just not sure that is true though that this is a disaster for the US. How much can China afford to fight back here with the state of their economy? Canada retaliating is asymmetrically bad for Canada.

Dollar strength and an emerging market currency breaking is what worries me. Inside the US, I would expect much of the potential inflation will just be exported through dollar strength. I imagine that is the method to the madness.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#66

Post by dutchbookmaker »

llm_nerd wrote: post #3

Canada was specifically warned not to retaliate in any manner, which is basically an acknowledgement that Canada has some powerful levers. This is farcical and of course Canada is going to retaliate. The $450B of American goods sold to Canada is going to collapse. The F35 purchase will be cancelled. Various other projects with the US will be abandoned. Oil will be export tariffed. Every American service -- Netflix, D…

The figures I have seen in a trade war with Canada is Canada causes a -.2% hit to US GDP while Canada gets a -2% hit. That is not going to work for Canada.

These aren't abuses of power though. We just largely got use to the president not trying to do all that much.

Obama issued 275 executive orders and Franklin Roosevelt issued 3721. Calvin Coolidge issued 1203. I think all the presidents during my lifetime combined issued less than Woodrow Wilson at 1803.

That is not to say I think a trade war with Canada is a good idea. It really makes no sense to me at all.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#67

Post by llm_nerd »

dutchbookmaker wrote: post #66
llm_nerd wrote: post #3

Canada was specifically warned not to retaliate in any manner, which is basically an acknowledgement that Canada has some powerful levers. This is farcical and of course Canada is going to retaliate. The $450B of American goods sold to Canada is going to collapse. The F35 purchase will be cancelled. Various other projects with the US will be abandoned. Oil will be export tariffed. Every American service -- Netflix, D…

The figures I have seen in a trade war with Canada is Canada causes a -.2% hit to US GDP while Canada gets a -2% hit. That is not going to work for Canada. These aren't abuses of power though. We just largely got use to the president not trying to do all that much. Obama issued 275 executive orders and Franklin Roosevelt issued 3721. Calvin Coolidge issued 1203. I think all the presidents during my lifetime combined…

>That is not going to work for Canada.

Is it going to shut up shop and close down? What does "not going to work" mean? The US is the one who chose this path, not Canada, and Canada is going to do what needs to be done for the situation the US forced it into. And FWIW, many Americans are a little in denial about how fragile your entire economy and social order is, and how little it takes to topple it. The impact of a trade war is likely to be much more significant than the "well it's just a trillion dollars of exports" rhetoric claims.

Canada has to "retaliate", in that it will adjust economic levers that will force production that currently happens in the US, serving the Canadian market, to adjust to players in Canada. Canada foolishly treated the US as an ally and partner and integrated our economies, so of course there is going to be pain. But to let you in on a little secret, a lot of Canadians have wanted this for a long time: There will be pain for a while, but Canada has increasingly become a branch office of the US. Despite enormous geographical, educational and social benefits it keeps falling behind. Trump is really just looking to MCGA. Next we can punt all of the US corporations out of Canada -- again, the ability for US businesses to operate freely in Canada is courtesy of NAFTA/USMCA. That agreement is defacto shredded now. The Canadian government needs to do everything possible to prevent discretionary dollars from travelling South of the border.

>These aren't abuses of power though.

Claiming a "border security" emergency -- a complete BS lie that only the incredibly stupid take at face value -- to push through an economic plan is absolutely, by every measure, a grotesque abuse of power. Americans are so accustomed to it now that it's just normal. If you think it isn't an abuse for your president to lie to you to have powers that he doesn't have, you have lowered your standards to corrupt banana republic levels.

Again, Canada and the US were operating under the trade agreement Trump forced on us the last time around. I don't see any clean exit of this where things return to normal. Canada must not ever treat the US as a sane, rational, responsible player on the world stage, as it constantly 180s on everything as American voters treat government like some perverse reality show.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#69

Post by therealpygon »

spacemanspiff01 wrote: post #68

...

Things make a lot more sense when you realize the benefits a recession has for the top 1% and will have for Trumps personal wealth. While yes, they will temporarily go through some pain in the form of a decrease in their net worth, a recession allows the rich to expand their businesses, consuming smaller businesses that are much harder hit by a recession and collecting their technology and markets for pennies. I don’t think there is a coincidence that all these billionaires are holding hands with Trump. It will also be a fantastic distraction as they convince people how this bill or that bill that quietly strips away your rights is going to be good for business and “bringing the economy back”.

The goal is pretty simple and obvious… Beat The People with the stick until they can barely move, then offer them a carrot and a shackle.

Re: Trump slaps tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China

#70

Post by llm_nerd »

Gunnerhead wrote: post #45
Grosvenor wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could start a joint nuclear program with Ukraine. Canada has the Canadian shield which is rich in Uranium. Both Canada and Ukraine get nukes (Ukraine has a bridge that needs blowing up), Ukraine gets safety, Canada gets huge reputation gains in trade with Ukraine. NB: Ukraine will be the fastest growing western economy post war for at least a decade or two.

Nukes for everyone yay! Hey Georgia is also under Russian threat, why don’t they also get a nuke or two? Then maybe their neighbor Armenia will think to themselves “why not me, I’m also under threat by an ex-Soviet country”? Then maybe Azerbaijan, then Turkey, then Saudi Arabia, everyone gets a nuke, I freaking love it! Then maybe other countries that got invaded by a bigger power like maybe Vietnam? Iraq? Why not!

I mean...why not? What moral right does the US have to nuclear weapons that others don't? US exceptionalism?

Just looking at what is happening in the US right now -- an astonishingly corrupt banana republic increasingly led by an insane Christian nationalist movement that bizarrely doesn't seem to understand a thing about Christ's teachings -- I have more faith in North Korea's management of nuclear weapons than the US.

Nuclear non-proliferation relied upon a global order where borders were fixed and there was in essence an international law and detente. Now we have an America openly musing about militarily taking countries and land as if it's just casual talk.

Yes, everyone should have nuclear weapons. And many of them should be pointed at US cities. The US is undeniably the most dangerous nation on Earth right now, and has lost any and all credibility as a rational player.

Post reply on HN