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Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

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Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#231

Post by fblp »

papichulo2023 wrote: post #44
fblp wrote: post #17

Given DeepSeek's open philosophy I wonder what their response is to simply being asked for access to the code and data that this project intends to recreate?

No company ever will disclose data due it would open endless liability.

Interesting, so they wouldn't want to disclose something that shows they've illegally (terms / copyright violations) scraped research databases for example.

Won't this eventually come up in legal discovery when someone sues one of these firms for copyright infringement? They'd have to share their data in the discovery process to show that they haven't infringed..

Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#232

Post by crocowhile »

bflesch wrote: post #37
crocowhile wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every now and then we still experience the power of collaborative work fueled by open source and not driven by money but curiosity and collegiality. This is the thing I miss the most from the early internet years.

"be the change you want to see in the world" - just start doing it. It's amazing how differently people interact with each other when collaborating on a passion project. For me, opensource software is the best way to do it. Pick a topic you're passionate about and start contributing somewhere :)

Oh, I do lots of open source. Everything my lab does is released as open source (eg https://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/article?id=10.1371/jou...)

We've never patented anything.

Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#233

Post by ossobuco »

redcobra762 wrote: post #230
ossobuco wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Watch: Palestine is not Israel. Yes, that works because you're an anon and nobody really cares. Try to publicly make that statement if you're in any relevant position and you'll very quickly be looking for a new job, if you can ever find it. > And if staging peaceful pro-Palestine protests result in arrests, what happened here? Be honest, you can literally google "Palestine protest arrests" and get more results tha…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashida_Tlaib would like a word. She would not be a politician (or even alive) if any of what you claim is true. You claimed that the US government censors people who speak out against Israel's occupation of Palestine, and specifically that saying Palestine isn't Israel would not be possible in the United States in the same way that saying, for example, Xi Jinping looks like Winnie the p…

Nice, you even have a token irrelevant politician without any power, perfect to use as example that all is allowed in the free US of A.

I'll reply with a few actual examples of what I mean:

- https://www.insidehighered.com/news/faculty-issues/academic-...

- https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/oct/24/university-p...

- https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2024/1/3/claudine-gay-res...

- https://hwsherald.com/2024/04/14/jodi-dean-suspended-from-te...

I think western propaganda is overall the cleverest, because it manages to completely marginalize and silence any non-aligned opinion, while at the same time convincing you that you are completely free to have said opinion.

Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#235

Post by redcobra762 »

ossobuco wrote: post #233
redcobra762 wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashida_Tlaib would like a word. She would not be a politician (or even alive) if any of what you claim is true. You claimed that the US government censors people who speak out against Israel's occupation of Palestine, and specifically that saying Palestine isn't Israel would not be possible in the United States in the same way that saying, for example, Xi Jinping looks like Winnie the p…

Nice, you even have a token irrelevant politician without any power, perfect to use as example that all is allowed in the free US of A. I'll reply with a few actual examples of what I mean: - https://www.insidehighered.com/news/faculty-issues/academic-... - https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/oct/24/university-p... - https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2024/1/3/claudine-gay-res... - https://hwsherald.com/2024/04/…

Why do you think anything you've just linked is at all related to this conversation? A system must be perfect to be good? That's an insane bar that is not the actual standard.

And if you think a US representative is powerless then you completely fail to understand how the US government actually works.

Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#236

Post by follower »

ayewo wrote: post #96
bananaflag wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gmail was the first time I saw a website which could refresh the information without refreshing the page. I was a teen back then but I realized it was something momentous.

OK, but I think it was Google Maps that made the experience of not needing to refresh the page popular (while being shown more information from the server). For a long time, you needed an invite to sign up for Gmail, so you couldn't easily share the cool experience of AJAX with others like you would with a Google Maps link.

> it was Google Maps that made the experience of not needing to refresh the page popular

IMO that's a reasonable impression of the times unless I'm forgetting something (and the additional observation about sharing--"virality" as it was called, before you know--was insightful).

At the time the previous "state of the art" was something like MapQuest which IIRC had a UI that essentially displayed a single tile and then required you to click on one of four directional arrow images to move the visible portion of the map, triggering a page load in the process (maybe a frame load?).

Yahoo! also "participated" in the mapping space at the time.

In the event anyone's interested in further ancient history around the topic, this page is actually (to my surprise) still online (with many broken links presumably): https://libgmail.sourceforge.net/googlemaps.html

(It's what we did for fun in the Times Before Social Media. :D )

Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#237

Post by foxglacier »

redcobra762 wrote: post #79
foxglacier wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is though. Western AI tries to hide information like that with the justification of safety as well as things that might be offensive to current popular beliefs. Chinese AI presumably says Taiwan is China to help get more people on side for a possible future invasion. Propaganda does work - look at how many people think Donbas is still Ukraine and Israel is still Palestine.

The difference is that in China the info isn’t available without use of Western content, due to the totalitarian control over media, whereas in the West, information is pretty trivially available, even if the big companies keep it off of their platforms. And sure ignorance is prevalent, but even GPT4 will tell me Donbas is still Ukraine, for instance. What a strange example to use, though!

"GPT4 will tell me Donbas is still Ukraine"

But is it though? What's really the meaning of which country a region belongs to? Once somewhere has been occupied long enough, it usually becomes de-facto theirs. But how long is long enough? Other countries either do or don't recognize it and usually a consensus is reached, but not always.

Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#238

Post by bflesch »

crocowhile wrote: post #232
bflesch wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"be the change you want to see in the world" - just start doing it. It's amazing how differently people interact with each other when collaborating on a passion project. For me, opensource software is the best way to do it. Pick a topic you're passionate about and start contributing somewhere :)

Oh, I do lots of open source. Everything my lab does is released as open source (eg https://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/article?id=10.1371/jou... ) We've never patented anything.

that looks like amazing work :)

Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#239

Post by rswail »

pitched wrote: post #119
rswail wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've got an original Apple ][ reference manual (red cover) with the hand annotated ROM listing. Also have SMALLTALK-80 book with it's railtrack diagrams of syntax on the inside covers. What's really interesting about the AI mania we're in is that no one has shown that what we have now will get to AGI and how. We have great models that simulate reasoning, but how close are they? How do we measure their quality? Benchm…

A different point of view on AGI is that we humans do not achieve AGI. Our brains aren’t capable of it. We get close enough to trick the other humans we compete against for resources. How would we prove that’s not true? Something like IQ tests? We don’t have good tests or benchmarks or tooling for this in ourselves, let alone the reproduction in machines. No one knows definitively what AGI actually is so, depending o…

> No one knows definitively what AGI actually is

The current "leaders" in this field are defining it to be whatever they think they can achieve by adding compute.

I know I have "general intelligence", but can I prove it to you (or anyone else)? Not really, but in my solipsistic world, I don't have to.

Maybe we should set some definitions before trying to "get there" when we don't where "there" is.

Re: Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1

#240

Post by numba888 »

jampekka wrote: post #170
numba888 wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> current LLMs would likely give better verdicts He probably meant _brainwashed_ LLMs. They can consistently produce desired results if you wash them the right way. It's more about personal opinion than computation. Actually it would be fun to manipulate verdicts with prompt injections ;)

Judges are very much "brainwashed" too, and by design. The judges should apply the law, and the same case should ideally lead to the same verdict regardless of the judge. With the caveat that this applies to sane legal systems, and not the ones where "making examples" etc are part of the system.

> The judges should apply the law, and the same case should ideally lead to the same verdict regardless of the judge.

hmm.. :) I like this. But the reality is very different and some factors which shouldn't matter can change the outcome dramatically. Like skin colors of defendant and judge. Pointing this out can be punished as well.

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