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Deferred resignation email to federal employees

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Re: Deferred resignation email to federal employees

#111

Post by tptacek »

rayiner wrote: post #102
tptacek wrote: post #100

Federal employees have statutory no-cause termination protection, and the President presumably can't simply reclassify the federal workforce as "at-will".

Article II says: “The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America.” I doubt it’s constitutional for employment law to preclude the president from firing any executive branch employee. It’s quite possible it’s constitutional to have contractual remedies for termination. I suspect that’s why there’s an 8 month severance.

I mean, if you want to see him set the land-speed record on getting a TRO, beating today's performance, by all means let's see him try. Your guess is good as mine which way Gorsuch and Kavanaugh will go on admin-law/separation-of-powers issues. Maybe it'll be resolved before the midterms!

My read of this is that no 8-month severance has been offered, for whatever that's worth.

Re: Deferred resignation email to federal employees

#112

Post by theyinwhy »

There is a huge difference between "creating lists for further use" and "offering buyouts". You sure those lists are only for offering buyouts, just because a notorious liar tells you so?

Discussion at reddit: https://old.reddit.com/r/fednews/comments/1ibbbh7/this_was_p...

Re: Deferred resignation email to federal employees

#113

Post by rayiner »

tptacek wrote: post #111
rayiner wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Article II says: “The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America.” I doubt it’s constitutional for employment law to preclude the president from firing any executive branch employee. It’s quite possible it’s constitutional to have contractual remedies for termination. I suspect that’s why there’s an 8 month severance.

I mean, if you want to see him set the land-speed record on getting a TRO, beating today's performance, by all means let's see him try. Your guess is good as mine which way Gorsuch and Kavanaugh will go on admin-law/separation-of-powers issues. Maybe it'll be resolved before the midterms! My read of this is that no 8-month severance has been offered, for whatever that's worth.

That’s what DOJ is for. He’s got the pointiest eggheads working for him now. He should litigate everything. And if people don’t like where we’re at in 2 years or 4 years, they’ll vote accordingly!

AP is reporting 8 months severance: https://apnews.com/article/trump-buyouts-to-all-federal-empl...

Re: Deferred resignation email to federal employees

#114

Post by [deleted] »

tptacek wrote: post #111
rayiner wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Article II says: “The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America.” I doubt it’s constitutional for employment law to preclude the president from firing any executive branch employee. It’s quite possible it’s constitutional to have contractual remedies for termination. I suspect that’s why there’s an 8 month severance.

I mean, if you want to see him set the land-speed record on getting a TRO, beating today's performance, by all means let's see him try. Your guess is good as mine which way Gorsuch and Kavanaugh will go on admin-law/separation-of-powers issues. Maybe it'll be resolved before the midterms! My read of this is that no 8-month severance has been offered, for whatever that's worth.

[deleted]

Re: Deferred resignation email to federal employees

#115

Post by kstrauser »

nullc wrote: post #86
kstrauser wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One more now.

Impersonating a federal officer or employee is a crime. 18 U.S. Code § 912 (technically you have to obtain a document, money, or other thing of value to run afoul of that particular law, but getting a reply to a successful spoof might qualify, and who knows whatever other laws it might violate, 25 CFR § 11.432 perhaps).

Oh noes! And we all know how famously rigorously spam and phishing is prosecuted!

(I didn’t actually do that. What stopped me is no longer being 12 years old, not a fear of going to Gitmo for sending an obviously fake email.)

Re: Deferred resignation email to federal employees

#116

Post by tptacek »

rayiner wrote: post #113
tptacek wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, if you want to see him set the land-speed record on getting a TRO, beating today's performance, by all means let's see him try. Your guess is good as mine which way Gorsuch and Kavanaugh will go on admin-law/separation-of-powers issues. Maybe it'll be resolved before the midterms! My read of this is that no 8-month severance has been offered, for whatever that's worth.

That’s what DOJ is for. He’s got the pointiest eggheads working for him now. He should litigate everything. And if people don’t like where we’re at in 2 years or 4 years, they’ll vote accordingly! AP is reporting 8 months severance: https://apnews.com/article/trump-buyouts-to-all-federal-empl...

Roberts Seila Law decision explicitly states that Congress can --- outside of the situation of heads of single-director independent agencies --- limit the removal powers of the President. Further, the logic you're using implies that the entire federal workforce is exempt from literally any employment law of any sort. You may respond that the administration's pointy eggheads are going to craft persuasive arguments to that effect, but I'd be happy to put money on their likelihood of success. What do you say?

I'm not interested in the politics of this, as you so often are. I'm just interested in people having a clear understanding of the dynamics at play here --- in people nerding out on legal issues. Except under a fringe interpretation of Unitary Executive theory, the President cannot simply ignore statutes like the CSRA.

Re: Deferred resignation email to federal employees

#119

Post by triyambakam »

DaSHacka wrote: post #94
fooblaster wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you miss the part where the mob that stormed the capital was fully pardoned despite the incredible violence? This is dictator shit. He's telling his supporters violence is okay against his political enemies and he will cover for you.

Is this not exactly what Biden also did in his last month in office? So far both presidents have blanket pardoned a mix of political allies, family members, and rioters right in front of the American public and no one's talking about it... I feel like I'm going crazy, are people really this oblivious?

You're not crazy, it's both sides. They're different sides of the same coin

Re: Deferred resignation email to federal employees

#120

Post by andy_ppp »

dillondoyle wrote: post #69
spencerflem wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuinely, who are you expecting to stand up against it? The Democrats in Congress? Massive public demonstration? It feels all but inevitable to me

I doubt public demonstrations would do it. They'd have to start losing MAGA cult people for them to change course themselves. But if we can hold out for 2 years (big if) there's a very strong chance we'll retake the house. And if things continue down this path (i think it will get worse) we could maybe take back the senate. but the map is very hard. That would give power to fight back. If we get a once in a generatio…

Trump will send the military in this time and kill protesters. Like he wanted to before.
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