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Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

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Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#41

Post by jmward01 »

pm90 wrote: post #17
blintz wrote: post #3

The electric Caltrain is so wonderful. It’s way quieter, the cars have nicer interiors, and it is running faster and more frequently than before. Between this, the new BART cars (also much quieter!), and Muni hitting a reliability & satisfaction records, there’s really a transit renaissance going on in the Bay Area. I really hope we can keep this going!

To unlock the true value of these systems the BA needs to be forced to increase density of their cities though. We need SF proper to look more like Manhattan.

It also needs a much bigger emphasis on transit oriented development. In Japan the best place to eat in town is often in the train station or within a few feet of it. In the US the stops are often some of the worst places like parking lots or run down parts of town. Rarely have I seen good shopping/dining/living integrated into BA, or even US in general, transit systems.

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#42

Post by offmycloud »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #19
insane_dreamer wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> BART police why does a transit system need its own police force? Aren't municipal and county police enough?

Presumably because police usually only have jurisdiction within their employer’s city limits, and sheriffs’ employees only have jurisdiction within their counties, so if mass transit moves between multiple jurisdictions, then their police can have jurisdiction wherever the mass transit goes (even across state lines, because a lot of metropolitan regions served by the same mass transit system span two or more states).

With prior consent, the authority of California peace officers extends to any place in the state. [1]

You would think that the counties could get together and work out an MoU.

1. https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySectio...

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#43

Post by lmm »

readdit wrote: post #4
jeffbee wrote: post #2

It's hilarious but sad to watch Americans learn things that agencies abroad already know. The other example of this I saw today was that in NYC the congestion pricing has "surprisingly" slashed the number of car crashes and injuries in Manhattan. Like, duh.

I feel this is positive news moving in a positive direction. Do you suggest not doing anything to improve the situation? We can’t go back in time. But we can help ourselves in the future.

One way to help yourselves in the future would be to learn the meta-lesson that actually things that work in other countries mostly work the same way in the US too.

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#44

Post by astar1 »

insane_dreamer wrote: post #12
infotainment wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed largely, though IMO BART is holding the bay area back. Unlike Caltrain and Muni, BART management is completely incompetent and more focused on spending their money on random things than actually running their transit system. Fun fact: BART police has a large fleet of SUVs, with the highest vehicle-to-officer ratio in the bay area (if only there were some other way for them to get around!) Fun exercise: compare…

> BART police why does a transit system need its own police force? Aren't municipal and county police enough?

[dead]

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#45

Post by ssuds »

infotainment wrote: post #8
blintz wrote: post #3

The electric Caltrain is so wonderful. It’s way quieter, the cars have nicer interiors, and it is running faster and more frequently than before. Between this, the new BART cars (also much quieter!), and Muni hitting a reliability & satisfaction records, there’s really a transit renaissance going on in the Bay Area. I really hope we can keep this going!

Agreed largely, though IMO BART is holding the bay area back. Unlike Caltrain and Muni, BART management is completely incompetent and more focused on spending their money on random things than actually running their transit system. Fun fact: BART police has a large fleet of SUVs, with the highest vehicle-to-officer ratio in the bay area (if only there were some other way for them to get around!) Fun exercise: compare…

Speaking of BART, this story is priceless: https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/bart-seat-slasher-hur...

The firm that reupholstered damaged BART seats in the ‘80s paid people to slash them so they’d get more business.

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#46

Post by markerz »

potato3732842 wrote: post #33
blintz wrote: post #3

The electric Caltrain is so wonderful. It’s way quieter, the cars have nicer interiors, and it is running faster and more frequently than before. Between this, the new BART cars (also much quieter!), and Muni hitting a reliability & satisfaction records, there’s really a transit renaissance going on in the Bay Area. I really hope we can keep this going!

> It’s way quieter, the cars have nicer interiors, and it is running faster and more frequently than before. Not that electric isn't a huge step up for all the usual reasons but most of that is just because it's new and hasn't been worn out yet.

Electric does help with getting cars to run quieter and faster though. With the old diesel engines, they needed more headway because of slower cold start times so there's more frequency and can hit the speed limit faster. Electric engines have high torque and are naturally much quieter.

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#47

Post by justinzollars »

> With the agency expecting approximately $6 million annually in energy credits from the California Air Resources Board’s Low Carbon Fuel Standard Program the first year of electric service will have lower fuel costs than the previous diesel service

Thats the key. Without the subsidy its more expensive and less efficient than carbon based fuel. In the long run we are worse off, because the subsidy can't last forever.

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#48

Post by astrange »

lswainemoore wrote: post #36
ninetyninenine wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haha. Doubtful. In your lifetime you won't see any transit system in the bay area that approaches anything remotely close to what you see in places like Tokyo or NYC. I get that there's improvement but like it's still rather pathetic compared to almost everywhere else across the pond.

Why so negative? Given that the served population is conservatively a quarter of either of those areas, doesn't seem like a fair comparison. More to the point, I've been favorably impressed with the transit options since moving here, and in terms of reliability it's been better than NYC, though obviously there are fewer trains/branches. I'd love to see BART open later, like NYC, but even Tokyo trains stop at midnight…

NYC is more or less the only system in the world that runs all night like that. It makes it very hard to do maintenance.

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#49

Post by mjrpes »

joshuamorton wrote: post #16
insane_dreamer wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> BART police why does a transit system need its own police force? Aren't municipal and county police enough?

BART exists in 5 counties (San Francisco, San Mateo, Alameda, Contra Costa, and Santa Clara) and multiple cities (SF, Oakland, San Jose, and multiple smaller ones). Having people who have jurisdiction in any bart station is useful. And for example, consistent foot patrols are valuable to BART but not necessarily valuable to the city of Hayward, or whatever. As a concrete example, BART has more or less a goal to be ab…

East Bay Regional Park District also has its own police force, for the same reasons.

Re: Caltrain's electric fleet more efficient than expected

#50

Post by astrange »

ninetyninenine wrote: post #6
blintz wrote: post #3

The electric Caltrain is so wonderful. It’s way quieter, the cars have nicer interiors, and it is running faster and more frequently than before. Between this, the new BART cars (also much quieter!), and Muni hitting a reliability & satisfaction records, there’s really a transit renaissance going on in the Bay Area. I really hope we can keep this going!

Haha. Doubtful. In your lifetime you won't see any transit system in the bay area that approaches anything remotely close to what you see in places like Tokyo or NYC. I get that there's improvement but like it's still rather pathetic compared to almost everywhere else across the pond.

If you copy Japan policies you can get something much closer to Japan, it's not magic.

(Transit oriented upzoning, no parking minimums, and businesses in the station building.)

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