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Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

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Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#61

Post by somishere »

why_at wrote: post #60
somishere wrote: post #59

During the pandemic / lockdown I was lucky enough to visit one of the reef pontoons off Cairns (Australia, on the Great Barrier Reef) that had been shut for several months. The resident Maori wrasse (a very large fish) at this pontoon, and others, has been known to have a relationship with some of the regular staff - often rubbing up against them in the water. When we jumped in the water that day the fish's reaction…

While I was scuba diving in Belize with some friends we encountered some Goliath Grouper which would follow us around. Later we were amazed when we saw another diver hold out her arms to one and it swam right up to her so she could hold it and pet it. Keep in mind this was a massive fish that probably weighed as much as a person. We asked her about it afterwards, turns out they just like being petted :). Eventually g…

Wow. We have a "Queensland" Grouper here .. similar size to the goliath, but there is no way I would hug it. A mate was a skipper of a dive boat and went for a freedive on their break - got a little bit too close to one that was chilling under the vessel. It opened it's mouth and sucked their head in. Happened very quickly. This person has a pretty decent breath hold, and experienced all round. But they thought that was it - all over. Until they were promptly spat out - never to venture within 10m of a fish that size again.

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#62

Post by riffraff »

Night_Thastus wrote: post #39
ysavir wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you. The older I get, the less and less tolerant I become of the concept of zoos and aquariums.

The better ones take really good care of the animals within. And I think they serve an important and not-irreplaceable purpose - exposure. They help show ordinary people, many of whom live in cities with no exposure to real nature, just what out there is worth protecting. I think it helps build public support for things like reducing waste, better fishing and hunting practices, the importance of parks and preserves,…

They ma provide good care, but how good can care be? A large animal would probably roam vast distances all the time and there's no way a zoo can allow that. Plus climate.

Polar bears at the zoo on plastic ice may be the saddest thing I've seen in my life, but how are you gonna provide tons and tons of ice for miles in a warm climate?

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#63

Post by sandworm101 »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #42
sandworm101 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, they famously carry a huge number of parasites. This just seems normal for the species, similar to how sloth fur supports a variety of organisms.

It's normal for all species, humans included. We generally aren't carrying large loads of parasites, but that's not because not doing so is normal. It's because we put tremendous effort into getting rid of them. This is one of the theories for why human body temperature seems to have lowered since the measurement was standardized at 37 C. There was a poem written about the phenomenon: Big fleas have little fleas upon…

But there is also a scientific measurement if parasite load. Not all species carry an equal amount.

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#64

Post by i_love_retros »

somishere wrote: post #59

During the pandemic / lockdown I was lucky enough to visit one of the reef pontoons off Cairns (Australia, on the Great Barrier Reef) that had been shut for several months. The resident Maori wrasse (a very large fish) at this pontoon, and others, has been known to have a relationship with some of the regular staff - often rubbing up against them in the water. When we jumped in the water that day the fish's reaction…

Other animals are really cool it's a shame we eat them and treat them so cruelly.

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#65

Post by HenryBemis »

i_love_retros wrote: post #64
somishere wrote: post #59

During the pandemic / lockdown I was lucky enough to visit one of the reef pontoons off Cairns (Australia, on the Great Barrier Reef) that had been shut for several months. The resident Maori wrasse (a very large fish) at this pontoon, and others, has been known to have a relationship with some of the regular staff - often rubbing up against them in the water. When we jumped in the water that day the fish's reaction…

Other animals are really cool it's a shame we eat them and treat them so cruelly.

We don't eat them because they are uncool, we eat them because we can farm them 'en masse' in a cost effective manner and they cannot escape. I've had moose, horse, and a few more non-typical farmed animals. I like horse steak the best. But, a beef steak costs X and a horse steak costs 5x.

It's a complicated multi-threaded discussion. I saw a vid recently from (I assume the UK) that people were protesting on the meat-alley of a super market. So those people are cool when the super market sells cigarettes, sugary drinks that cause diabetes to kids, 'chocolates' with 50% sugar, alcohol that ruins millions of lives around the world, etc. But steak.. that is their problem. Oh the hypocrisy.

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#66

Post by lxgr »

HenryBemis wrote: post #65
i_love_retros wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other animals are really cool it's a shame we eat them and treat them so cruelly.

We don't eat them because they are uncool, we eat them because we can farm them 'en masse' in a cost effective manner and they cannot escape. I've had moose, horse, and a few more non-typical farmed animals. I like horse steak the best. But, a beef steak costs X and a horse steak costs 5x. It's a complicated multi-threaded discussion. I saw a vid recently from (I assume the UK) that people were protesting on the meat…

That’s a textbook example of whataboutism if I’ve ever seen one, but it’s also a category error:

Selling cigarettes harms the buyers, but selling factory-farmed meat harms the animals being factory farmed, and they don’t have any agency in this at all.

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#67

Post by lxgr »

lostlogin wrote: post #5
classichasclass wrote: post #3

We "met" a king penguin at Singapore Bird Paradise that would follow people around at the edge of the tank (an acrylic sheet separated you from their enclosure) and try to interact. It swam up to my wife and followed her around, then went to another bunch of people and did the same. It seemed to enjoy watching people watching it and waving to it. Not every animal does, but this one did.

I’m not sure if it applies with all birds, but many seem to become fixated on humans. This can happen if you care for very young, sick or injured birds. My wife cares for various sad cases and if she isn’t careful they stay with with us. We have 4 pigeons at the moment, with various issues. I call them our rehoming pigeons. Do you want a pigeon?

Birds can imprint on humans when exposed to them at some critical period after hatching, which seems adorable at a first glance, but can ultimately be a problem for birds that could otherwise be released into the wild, as it’s often irreversible.

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#68

Post by lxgr »

James_K wrote: post #41
elzbardico wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most zoos nowadays are important research centers. Besides that, they have an important educational component that surely contributes politically for conservation efforts.

False dichotomy. If we wanted to, we could do both preservation and not lock them up.

It’s highly questionable if wildlife and habitat protection had the same level of political support if most people would only knew the affected animals from photos and nature documentaries. Zoos can have a lasting impact on people.

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#69

Post by melagonster »

HenryBemis wrote: post #65
i_love_retros wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other animals are really cool it's a shame we eat them and treat them so cruelly.

We don't eat them because they are uncool, we eat them because we can farm them 'en masse' in a cost effective manner and they cannot escape. I've had moose, horse, and a few more non-typical farmed animals. I like horse steak the best. But, a beef steak costs X and a horse steak costs 5x. It's a complicated multi-threaded discussion. I saw a vid recently from (I assume the UK) that people were protesting on the meat…

Sorry, most of fish we eat were not farmed by human.

Re: Lonely sunfish in Japan gets cardboard human friends

#70

Post by thaumasiotes »

James_K wrote: post #56
thaumasiotes wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a counter argument: we could just do it. Increase taxes by the amount people spend in zoos and spend that on conservation. Why do you think we could do that? I say we could just increase taxes by $5,000 per person per year and spend it on breeding and releasing mosquitoes in Los Angeles.

Yes, we could do that, but what would be the benefit? I'm saying that whether we want nature conserved and whether we want them to be in cages for us to look at are entirely separate issues that should be evaluated separately. The best argument in favour of zoos is assuming that the people who want to look at dancing bears would be sufficiently enraged by their absence that they would decide to condemn the whole of n…

I suggest to you that if you try to make that happen, you'll find that in fact you can't. Not everything you can imagine people doing is something that it's actually possible to make them do.
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