UK's hardware talent is being wasted • Hacker News Board

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#861

Post by twic » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:10 PM UTC

Symbiote wrote: post #824

louthy wrote: post #723

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Isn't JLR in Solihull? That's two hours from London. Not 100% sure, I'm from the middle of nowhere, sorry, Derby - where Rolls Royce is primarily based. I know there's peak-time, non-stop, trains between London/Derby that take about an hour. I know this because when I got my first job in London, I still hadn't found a place to stay, so I was commuting from Derby to London every day. And when I finally moved to Lond…

It's 89 minutes minimum from Derby to London. The fastest trains stop once, in Leicester. It's also £135 off-peak return, so a night out in Birmingham might be more appealing.

Pints are about a quarter the price too!

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#862

Post by twic » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:11 PM UTC

youngtaff wrote: post #396

refrigerator wrote: post #19

This is spot on. All the smart and ambitious people I know who studied (non-software) Engineering at university in the UK have ended up going into software engineering via self-teaching or finance/consulting because the only hardware engineering career paths seem to be working for Rolls Royce in the middle of nowhere with terrible pay, or alternatively working at Jaguar Land Rover in the middle of nowhere with terrib…

Coventry is hardly the middle of nowhere

Coventry is the capital of nowhere.

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#863

Post by constantcrying » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:15 PM UTC

monero-xmr wrote: post #110

smartties wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems to be the case for most European countries, particularly here in France. We’re experiencing stagnation, or perhaps even a decline. Launching a product in Europe is significantly more challenging due to the market’s high fragmentation. I don’t have much hope for the future of tech companies in Europe.

It’s exhausting trying to explain this to American leftists. They believe the UK / EU is rich, their healthcare is amazing and “free”, and no one has to work more than 35 hours a week. They visit London and Paris once in 10 years for vacation and think they understand the economic order.

American leftist discourse about Europe is always hilarious. Apparently someone forgot to tell them that the "free" healthcare just means that it is forcibly deducted from your pay and only "free" if you don't work (Free meaning the people who work pay for you). Also they forget to mention that the actual health care system is chronically understaffed and that you should avoid the hospital if at all possible and that you might wait months to see a specialist.

Car discourse is another very good one. Apparently Europeans just really hate cars and take bikes/busses everywhere. They seem to genuinely believe that the US is the only country in the world with a car culture.

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#864

Post by constantcrying » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:18 PM UTC

brewdad wrote: post #856

constantcrying wrote: post #840

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Maybe what we need is a property price crash. What is needed is a steady decrease in demand or an increase in supply. The cost of living crisis is directly caused by the huge bureaucracy needed to build new housing. And speculators are benefiting from that. As long as governments are unwilling to let go of regulations housing costs will only increase.

There is no appetite for increasing supply anywhere in the West. Maybe Trump will get us into WWIII and we can shift the demand curve.

>There is no appetite for increasing supply anywhere in the West.

Every single person who currently is looking to rent or buy a house has appetite for increasing market supply.

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#865

Post by mbesto » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:21 PM UTC

r_thambapillai wrote: post #51

As a Brit, when I was raising the seed round for my startup, UK and European VCs would consistently try to haggle you down on price while the American VC's were exclusively focussed on trying to figure out whether this could be a billion dollar business or not (in the end we raised a $5m seed led by Spark, and have done extremely well and raised more since). The UK lost Deep Mind - which could have been OpenAI!! -- t…

As a former founder (formerly living in London) trying to raise VC funding in London this is exactly what my experience.

I once did a pitch contest and they required we put together a business plan with financials. You want me to...what? Who on earth can read a pro forma for a pre-revenue SaaS business and say "ah yes this is worth of investment because this pro forma looks great".

London is all about banking and it shows.

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#866

Post by Chris2048 » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:22 PM UTC

Symbiote wrote: post #829

Chris2048 wrote: post #807

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are these real examples? I was curious, and all I could find it: https://newsforkids.net/articles/2024/09/04/16-year-old-stud... They are not working in Fintech AFAIK.

They seem believable to me, as a graduate of the same university. I have friends from Imperial College who now work at ESA, Los Alamos, quantum computer research etc, but also others working in banks, hedge funds or adtech. Top of my computer science class is working at a hedge fund, number two is working at a fintech startup. It's on their website, even specifically for electrical engineers (since that's the topic)…

I work in finance too and see similar, but are these examples real, or a remix of real examples.

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#867

Post by Beretta_Vexee » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:27 PM UTC

petra wrote: post #776

llm_trw wrote: post #635

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd go one further and say you have to be at least a journeyman in whatever tools your process is using. The difference between someone designing a part in cad and someone designing the tool paths for the machine that makes the part in cam is night and day.

What about using simulation(or estimation using software) to understand the manufacturing process well enough to design for it, without being in the factory?

Simulation is a tool. Determining whether the results of a simulation are consistent and valid requires a great deal of experience. Almost anyone can use fluid mechanics simulation software and obtain beautiful multicolor images. Only an expert will be able to determine whether they're worth anything, and when it's time to run a mock-up to validate calculations.

Simulation can help train new engineers, helping them to understand complex physical phenomena, but it cannot replace field experience.

The organization of the production site, the employees and the quality culture are an integral part of the production tool, and cannot be simulated.

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#868

Post by brewdad » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:33 PM UTC

paganel wrote: post #376

mrtksn wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it? How many people skipped getting rich because they could have been richer? Any factual examples? BTW, rich don't actually pay much taxes. The luxury life they live is usually not taxed, most of the things they do is considered business expense. When a worker flies to Ibiza they first pay social security and income taxes, then they pay consumption taxes like VAT. When a businessman flies to Ibiza they deduct w…

What the OP is trying to say is that to grow from 50k euros earned per year to 1 million euros earned per year is very, very cumbersome and, yes, mentally challenging and very stressful, and that a lot of people actively choose to stay/remain at the 50k euros per year level and they'll not take the risks of trying to get to more than 1 million per year. Once you're at more than 1 million per year there are other chal…

Those problems are universal. Or do you honestly think that American startups don't need to hire an accountant and consult with lawyers? You either find the risk/reward proposition worthwhile or you don't. There's nothing wrong with not pursuing the riskier avenue but don't pretend the US makes it easy.

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#869

Post by creer » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:34 PM UTC

constantcrying wrote: post #834

wcfrobert wrote: post #726

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US outsourced its manufacturing to China in the name of comparative advantage. Bob bakes bread, Alice grow apples. Everyone is better off because of specialization. In Thomas Friedman's latest nyt column, he refers to China's manufacturing dominance as a play to de-industrializing other countries. It may just be globalization is incompatible with political realities.

>Bob bakes bread, Alice grow apples. Everyone is better off because of specialization. America is 300 Million. Europe is almost a Billion. These populations are more than large enough to specialize in everything. >Everyone is better off because of specialization. Why?

> These populations are more than large enough to specialize in everything.

My impression is that population size is not very relevant in the math of trade specialization profit. It's still more profitable to play on relative strengths and weaknesses. You can find other things to worry about like security (from droughts and earthquakes perhaps), or political or strategic desires. In particular, trade is likely beneficial even when local production would be cheaper than remote production - just because there are other things that can be done localy and even stronger (like phone games or advertising-oriented browser feature destruction /s).

Re: UK's hardware talent is being wasted

#870

Post by twic » Mon, Jan 20, 2025, 8:35 PM UTC

CalRobert wrote: post #216

Earw0rm wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem isn't building stuff, it's building stuff where stuff needs to be. We built plenty of out-of-town shopping centres, business parks and industrial estates in the 70s, 80s, 90s. We stopped because it turns out they're, for the most part, shit. Given the choice, people will WFH and order off Amazon rather than go within a mile of these places. What we need is to tackle the vested interests in the towns and c…

BUUUT MuHHH PAAARRRKiiiiNNNGGGG!! (And house values). And we can't _possibly_ make the town look different than it did in 1972 because "heritage". We're talking about a bunch of crusty old church biddies who will literally force you to put the most godawful, hideous house covering in the history of man BACK on your house because they're terrified of being reminded it's not the 70's. (Sorry for the mail link) https://…

Hold on though, that's not 1970s pebble dash, that's 1920s pebble dash, that was on the house when it was built (ish - seems that area was built up between 184 and 1914). The house is in a conservation area, which means you've got to keep it looking original. If you don't want to do that, just don't move to a conservation area!

Found a non-Mail link BTW: https://www.camdennewjournal.co.uk/article/planning-inspecto...