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I Met Paul Graham Once

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Re: I Met Paul Graham Once

#201

Post by Nevermark »

rexpop wrote: post #158
Nevermark wrote: post #102

There are a lot of things that bother me these days. But particularly some things that are pervasive, unnecessary, habitual amplifiers of disagreement. If someone is going to address extremists on an issue, don't just be anti-extremist. What empty courage is that? Address extremists by pushing the dialog back to the real issue. In this case, treating people who have been denigrated for centuries better. Otherwise, un…

You make a good point that no one else had, afaik: PG is strawmanning, and not steelmanning his opponents. This is craven.

So much said, with such fewer words ... :)

And giving voice to power vs. power, instead of to the less powerful. Reduced by both "sides" to pawns, their needs to playing cards.

Re: I Met Paul Graham Once

#203

Post by Suppafly »

ethbr1 wrote: post #198
Suppafly wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>or even those they associate with themselves I see no problem judging someone for the identities that they choose to associate themselves with.

Over and above their works and words?

Their associations are their works and words. You can't just handwave that stuff away as being irrelevant because you like the parts of their works and words that don't touch on anything you deem to be an association.

Re: I Met Paul Graham Once

#206

Post by inglor_cz »

selimthegrim wrote: post #200
inglor_cz wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"who told America that Islam is a religion of peace" This is something I considered a brazen lie in the interest of stability. I believe in existence of individual peaceful Muslims, but I don't believe in inherent peacefulness of a religion founded by a warrior who converted Arabia by the sword and which had since seen an endless series of holy wars initiated in the name of Islam. You can't really build societal unde…

To pretend that every Muslim area in the world was converted by the sword is just totally unsupportable

I haven't said that every Muslim area in the world was converted by the sword.

But Muhammad led a lot of wars, in which thousands died. Which is fairly untypical among the founders of currently widespread religions, though the Old Testament heroes like Joshua can be categorized into a very similar slot.

Re: I Met Paul Graham Once

#207

Post by _1tem »

Philpax wrote: post #166
_1tem wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even most of the world right now doesn’t care about wokeness and never has. India, the Middle East, Africa, China, Russia etc. never caught on to most woke stuff that came out of the west in the past 20 years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender_history

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woke

Re: I Met Paul Graham Once

#208

Post by inglor_cz »

snowwrestler wrote: post #199
inglor_cz wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you about a transgender person who is 23, but not about anyone who is claiming to be transgender at 13. That is way too young to be sure of such things, and peer pressures/influences exist. The current backlash is mostly caused by the hardcore activists pressuring for "the alternatives are either gender-affirming care or SUICIDE! SUICIDE! even for 13 y.o.'s" This attitude is so hysterical that it cannot…

There is a social movement that seeks the suppression of all transgender expression, including by fully informed adults. They led with “save the kids” for the emotional impact, as many other well-organized social movements have in the past. It works because concerns about kids are real. But it’s important to see and understand the greater goals of the movement, and how it affects everyone. The essay at the top of thi…

It is somewhat quaint, but the truth is often in the middle and compromises work the best.

Which is something that doesn't really resonate with the social network era, which rewards wild posturing and extreme views with attention and clicks.

Re: I Met Paul Graham Once

#210

Post by [deleted] »

DeathRay2K wrote: post #68
slibhb wrote: post #41

I thought this was better than most essays in this vein. I do fundamentally disagree with the author. People can think poorly of you for whatever reason they want. If someone hates trans people, they can, and you can't stop them. The whole "war on hate" thing was a bad idea; you can't forbid hatred. It predictably didn't work, and it's good that we're turning away from it. Adding on, the trans issue isn't simple. The…

You’re wrong that a so-called “war on hate” doesn’t work. More correctly, it doesn’t work in the US because of the first amendment and the few limitations on it. Many other countries have robust anti-hate speech laws that are effective, although less so in the age of the internet. People broadly conform to the society in which they live, and the rules of the society are broadly set by the laws they adhere to. So in c…

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