Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll • Hacker News Board

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#71

Post by Arwill » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 4:56 PM UTC

This is pretty fucked up. So now anyone in the world can expect to be sued in the US on base of US software patents? How do you release anything in a situation like this. Then there is the burden of going to a court in Texas? How in the fuck they expect that a Swedish company hires lawyers in Texas? Just how much would that cost? Also this is going to beyond any sanity. Practically you have to stick to some common "protected by a big company" technology, else you run the risk of inventing something new (on your own), and running into some broadly worded patent.

This is actually contrary to "protecting innovation". If you actually innovate, you run the risk inventing something that someone already patented, and then you are fucked. Under such circumstances its much safer to just not try to innovate...

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#72

Post by DanBC » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:01 PM UTC

simonw wrote: post #49

ivanvanderbyl wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was actually quite surprised to read this on HN, I once met Ric Richardson the founder of Uniloc shortly after he sued Microsoft for infringing a similar patent, and I usually laugh at anyone trying to enforce software patents but this time I would take it a lot more seriously.

Why would you take it a lot more seriously?

Because the decision has flip-flopped a few times, but at the moment Microsoft has settled.

(http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-03-05/microsoft-settles-f...)

MS has lawyers, and money, and time, and thus for them to lose is concerning. (Not saying anything about the applicability of this patent to Mojang.)

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#73

Post by DanBC » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:03 PM UTC

Notch should mobilise some of those millions of players.

(http://www.usa.gov/Contact/Elected.shtml)

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#74

Post by kposehn » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:16 PM UTC

What I find so hilarious about this is that they refer to it as "Mindcraft".

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#75

Post by kstrauser » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:24 PM UTC

I propose a fun and existing amendment to intellectual property cases: if the plaintiff loses, the defendant gets to shoot the plaintiff (or the plaintiff's CEO) and the losing legal team. Not at a distant time and place, mind you, but right there on the spot. "We the jury find the defendant not liable blam blam."

I think that should reduce the number of patent lawsuits to approximately the number appropriate for an educated and free society. If you really, really feel that you've been wronged, go for it! But don't waste the court's or society's time, resources, and goodwill on horrid antisocial crud like this.

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#76

Post by mdc » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:27 PM UTC

huhtenberg wrote: post #54

mdc wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. huhtenberg's analogy was flawed. His analogy to selling liquor only works if you remote-access a computer in Sweden and then buy Minecraft from that computer. Then when you copy Minecraft from the remote to your home system, you're the importer. If you buy from a US-based computer then it's Mojang acting as an importer to the US. The liquor analogy would be if you ordered a bottle of liquor to be shipped to th…

Neither your nor my interpretation of an online purchase is a correct one. An online purchase from a computer in one country at a web server in another can be treated as both an import (by a purchaser) and an export (by a seller). But since a sale is typically solicited by a purchaser (it's driven by those who purchase), I'd say it's an import rather than an export. > liquor to be shipped to the US and the liquor sto…

>it has no other reason not to send a bottle into the US

Except to serve it's customer, because if it doesn't meet import requirements then the customer's package will never arrive. I understand it may not be legally obligated so there's no repercussion except the shipment being confiscated, but it's in business to serve customers.

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#77

Post by rprasad » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:47 PM UTC

sigkill wrote: post #45

This article suddenly reminded me of another link that was on front page a few weeks ago. That one was on how to incorporate a company in another country without being there. People wanted to incorporate their software startups in the US due to ease of payment processing and stuff. After seeing these kind of patent trolls, I wonder if anyone would even think of incorporating the the US. If your product is internation…

Logged in just to reply.

European IP law makes US IP law look like a walk in the park. The RIAA and MPAA notwithstanding, the US has actually been the voice of restraint in the IP rights field. Enforcement and defense is also easier, as you do not have to contend with a variety of separate court systems as you do in Europe or Asia.

That being said, if you are running an international operation, your IP should never been based in the US for tax reasons. It should be held by an Irish (or other low-tax jurisdiction) company dedicated to holding your IP (i.e., an "IP holding company").

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#78

Post by Vivtek » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:49 PM UTC

sigkill wrote: post #60

hmmmmmmmmmm wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would this be a viable way to escape some frivolous patent lawsuit? I've often wondered about this, and even tried to research it somewhat, but I'm still unsure about it. Suppose I have an LLC for my small (one-man) business in the U.S., and then I get targeted by a patent troll with some ridiculous claims. Can I simply start up another LLC in another country (one with saner patent laws), transfer my domains/hosting/…

Even I would like an expert to answer this. Assuming my domain is a .com domain, does the USA have jurisdiction over the company even if say, it's registered in Sweden?

I'd also like to hear an expert's opinion, but isn't the entire point of a limited liability company to limit liability?

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#79

Post by rprasad » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:54 PM UTC

hmmmmmmmmmm wrote: post #52

Vivtek wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why you would set up a subsidiary LLC in the United States, and dissolve it if it's sued.

Would this be a viable way to escape some frivolous patent lawsuit? I've often wondered about this, and even tried to research it somewhat, but I'm still unsure about it. Suppose I have an LLC for my small (one-man) business in the U.S., and then I get targeted by a patent troll with some ridiculous claims. Can I simply start up another LLC in another country (one with saner patent laws), transfer my domains/hosting/…

The U.S. has jurisdiction over ICANN and thus over all TLD's that are not country TLDs (i.e., .co, .tv, .ly, etc.). But jurisdiction extends only to the domain itself, not to the company, unless you are doing business in the U.S., in which case you are subject to the jurisdiction of the U.S. to the extent of your business contacts. Transferring your U.S. assets will probably not spare you, as jurisdiction is established by past or present contacts (though past in this context means at the time of the tort/claim giving rise to the lawsuit).

Re: Mojang, makers of Minecraft, sued by patent troll

#80

Post by rprasad » Sat, Jul 21, 2012, 5:56 PM UTC

DrJokepu wrote: post #30

Kiro wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what happens when they don't have a legal entity in the US? Who will enforce it?

They can stop the distribution in the United Stares. In addition, Swedish courts would probably honor the decision of the US court.

Enforcement limited to the U.S. European courts do not honor software patents.