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What if no one misses TikTok?

nytimes.com

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Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#61

Post by tzs »

mupuff1234 wrote: post #28
ok123456 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is that insane? We should lead by example if we value free speech.

So if China would pay $100 a month to every teacher in the US to teach some subversive topic, would that also be ok? The issue here isn't free speech, but control over what content is promoted, unless you think the CCP has the right to free speech in the US.

> So if China would pay $100 a month to every teacher in the US to teach some subversive topic, would that also be ok?

It would not be OK, but not because it is China. It would not be OK because it is not OK for anyone to do that.

Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#62

Post by crummy »

ericmay wrote: post #42
wongarsu wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China doesn't claim that free speech and personal freedom are part of their core values

Sure but what would that have to do with this action here? TikTok isn’t being banned because of free speech or not but because the usage of their algorithms allows the app to influence how Americans think about different issues. China has recognized this as a threat and as such has banned foreign adversary social media companies from operating within its borders. Likewise the United States has recognized that this is…

> but because the usage of their algorithms allows the app to influence how Americans think about different issues

Is that the case or is that just assumed what the government means when they say issues of national security? I thought they meant our devices could be hacked by malicious code in TikTok apps.

Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#63

Post by seanmcdirmid »

wongarsu wrote: post #26
daft_pink wrote: post #8

It’s totally insane that China can ban all American social networks on security concerns and ban all kinds of just basic speech on their apps, but banning a Chinese social network is so controversial.

China doesn't claim that free speech and personal freedom are part of their core values

China’s constitution definitely guarantees both, it even says without exception.

Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#65

Post by [deleted] »

addicted wrote: post #29

India banned TikTok and a whole host of other Chinese apps and after a few days of moaning they moved completely on. So the evidence indicates that no one will actually care. And TikTok is even less sticky than say Twitter. TikTok isn’t about the relationship graph you painstakingly built. It’s about the algorithm and the FYP it populates. That can be recreated instantly. Moving away from Twitter was hard because one…

[deleted]

Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#66

Post by [deleted] »

spencerflem wrote: post #60
nozzlegear wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An American and a Chinese citizen are having a discussion on Rednote about freedom in their respective countries. The American proudly says: "In America, we have true freedom! I can stand in front of the White House and shout, 'I don’t like the President!' and nothing will happen to me." The Chinese citizen thoughtfully replies: "We have the same freedom in China. I can stand in front of Tiananmen Square and shout, '…

shouting is allowed because the powers that be know it is ineffective if its looking like it wont be they gun you down. see: occupy wall st., unionization efforts

[deleted]

Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#67

Post by ThrowawayR2 »

ok123456 wrote: post #12
daft_pink wrote: post #8

It’s totally insane that China can ban all American social networks on security concerns and ban all kinds of just basic speech on their apps, but banning a Chinese social network is so controversial.

Why is that insane? We should lead by example if we value free speech.

Arguing for individual humans to have freedom of speech to express their views is one thing, arguing for mega-corporations (look at the valuation estimates for Tiktok) to have freedom of speech for profit is quite another.

Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#68

Post by nozzlegear »

seo-speedwagon wrote: post #56
addicted wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine thinking the U.S. govt and corporate overlords are terrible because they’re banning TikTok and getting back at them by going to a Chinese app. China, the country which has a literal firewall preventing their people from getting information that isn’t vetted, bans nearly every external app because they don’t have control over it, and most ironically, never allowed TikTok, whose banning you think makes the U.S.…

Most people I’ve seen are going on about either 1) the novelty of talking to entirely new people, which is a relative rarity since the early, heady days of MySpace when social media was new and gardens felt much less walled. For Gen Z, it might actually be a first given their average age; or 2) how the lives of average people compare to theirs and compare to their prior notions of what they thought life was like Thes…

> These seem to go both ways btw, e.g. Chinese people being amazed that we really do need to pay for ambulance rides and that it’s not just govt propaganda. People are going where interesting things are happening, it’s plain and simple.

Sadly, since Rednote is monitored and censored by the CCP, the novelty and depth of those 'wow, your country is really like that?' conversations is rather one-sided. You can bet if the conversation is going to paint a country in a negative light (e.g. Ambulance rides), that country probably isn't going to be China.

Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#69

Post by nozzlegear »

spencerflem wrote: post #60
nozzlegear wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An American and a Chinese citizen are having a discussion on Rednote about freedom in their respective countries. The American proudly says: "In America, we have true freedom! I can stand in front of the White House and shout, 'I don’t like the President!' and nothing will happen to me." The Chinese citizen thoughtfully replies: "We have the same freedom in China. I can stand in front of Tiananmen Square and shout, '…

shouting is allowed because the powers that be know it is ineffective if its looking like it wont be they gun you down. see: occupy wall st., unionization efforts

That's an interesting theory, some would call it conspiratorial, but regardless it's not quite the point.

Re: What if no one misses TikTok?

#70

Post by UtopiaPunk »

geor9e wrote: post #22
daft_pink wrote: post #8

It’s totally insane that China can ban all American social networks on security concerns and ban all kinds of just basic speech on their apps, but banning a Chinese social network is so controversial.

According to the youth, it's more about a government censoring what speech their citizens can see. The CCP does it, sure. But America doing it feels new.

Well, not new. But hypocritical, definitely.
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