Live data from Hacker News

Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

theguardian.com

61–70 of 282 posts

Re: Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

#61
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you also need to measure the dampening impact on home building. If builders would have built N units knowing they could easily sell some % them to foreign buyers but now they can’t, then you might lose the whole supply. And all the knock on effects for contractors, suppliers, etc

Cities are rarely constrained by the willingness of someone to build housing, it’s generally more an issue of being allowed to build housing.

For the most extreme example just look at San Francisco here in the US, where the average number of legally-allowed new housing units is currently around 3.5 total per month (https://sfstandard.com/2024/04/08/san-francisco-new-housing-...) in a city of 873,000 people.

Re: Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

#62
post #4

so is there any actual evidence that foreign home ownership is causing meaningful housing price inflation in Spain? or is this just uninformed pandering like it is in the US

What's causing it in the US?

A housing bust in 2008 washed a lot of capital and talent out of the house construction industry, and the current boom is hard to supply with construction capacity even when there is land to build on. And also, even if the land exists, there is already a SFH on it that needs to be torn down, so we are densifying at a slower rate than we need to. Couple that with an even increasing focus of good job opportunities into a few hot metros, the whole US housing market becomes one hot mess.

Re: Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

#63
post #44

Just tax land value.

How do you calculate the unimproved land value? This is an interesting question with the fires in LA right now. Is the land still as valuable as it was before the house burned down, minus the rebuild cost of the house? Or is the value intrinsically tied to the community that was there but no longer is? Or is the value actually higher now that a developer can come in and remake an entire neighborhood?

Interesting game theory situation:

- if land value depends on the community that was there, then owners would all have incentive to rebuild their burnt down houses to regain the values.

- but owners probably realize most owners will sell their property as soon as things are back to normal. that would reduce the value of surrounding houses.

- so owners will rebuild as fast as possible, probably cutting lots of corners, just so they won't left behind to sell.

- some people start selling their houses but the late comers realize it's not worth it for them to sell it because the value has dropped a lot. so they stay.

- the new owners move in to the area and house prices go back up.

Re: Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> preferences for larger/fancier houses And more space per person, so older houses now house far fewer than they used to. US has more bedrooms without an occupant than ever. https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/09/realestate/empty-bedrooms...

I wonder how empty-nesting attributes to this. My parents have 3 empty (really, repurposed) bedrooms in their house now. But downsizing in their area wouldn’t actually help financially, so they don’t.

In my case, most elderly relatives own their largest homes ever for when kids visit. So many bedrooms have never had a full time occupant.

Re: Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

#66
post #36
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many % of flats are empty? At least in the US the hottest housing markets usually have the lowest vacancy rates. This makes sense, because the opportunity costs for leaving a property empty is higher, so owners are more tempted to rent them out.

The vacancy rates are deceiving though. If you have a place that is owned by someone and they are paying taxes on it, and it's not listed as a rental, it's not considered vacant. In big cities there are definitely homes that are empty and not listed being used as a store of wealth. In fact just within view of my own home are two houses like that. Both owned by foreign families who wanted a safer place to keep their w…

>The vacancy rates are deceiving though. If you have a place that is owned by someone and they are paying taxes on it, and it's not listed as a rental, it's not considered vacant.

Why would you lie like that?

https://www.census.gov/housing/hvs/definitions.pdf

Occupied Housing Units. A housing unit is occupied if a person or group of persons is living in it at the time of the interview or if the occupants are only temporarily absent, as for example, on vacation. The persons living in the unit must consider it their usual place of residence or have no usual place of residence elsewhere. The count of occupied housing units is the same as the count of households

Vacant Housing Units. A housing unit is vacant if no one is living in it at the time of the interview, unless its occupants are only temporarily absent. In addition, a vacant unit may be one which is entirely occupied by persons who have a usual residence elsewhere. New units not yet occupied are classified as vacant housing units if construction has reached a point where all exterior windows and doors are installed and final usable floors are in place. Vacant units are excluded if they are exposed to the elements, that is, if the roof, walls, windows, or doors no longer protect the interior from the elements, or if there is positive evidence (such as a sign on the house or block) that the unit is to be demolished or is condemned. Also excluded are quarters being used entirely for nonresidential purposes, such as a store or an office, or quarters used for the storage of business supplies or inventory, machinery, or agricultural products. Vacant sleeping rooms in lodging houses, transient accommodations, barracks, and other quarters not defined as housing units are not included in the statistics in this report. (See section on "Housing Unit.")

Re: Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

#67

so is there any actual evidence that foreign home ownership is causing meaningful housing price inflation in Spain? or is this just uninformed pandering like it is in the US

For the last years we’ve had 500K immigrants coming every year. That’s what’s causing inflation.

Re: Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

#68
post #6
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's causing it in the US?

In Canada potentially Chinese immigrants in Vancouver/Toronto, in the US it's an over-generous monetary policy (through low interest rates, especially during COVID)

they've slashed immigration, so I guess we'll find out. BC is also going to tax any sales after less than 2 years of ownership; I'm doubtful this will increase affordability or supply, but it will essentially kill the economic model of renovation & flipping.

Re: Spain proposes 100% tax on homes bought by non-EU residents

#70

so is there any actual evidence that foreign home ownership is causing meaningful housing price inflation in Spain? or is this just uninformed pandering like it is in the US

Totally anecdotal, but I live in the largest city in Spain, and even in my residential area (as opposed to the touristy spots) every week I can see ads for "we buy your house, paid upfront over market value, Chinese investors". Posters in walls, flyers in windshields and so on.

This is excellent, assets like property don't grow on trees and needs to be protected from foreign investors.

Absolutely need something like this in the UK.

Post reply on HN