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Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

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Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#111

Post by gosub100 »

sjm-lbm wrote: post #33
Bhilai wrote: post #22

I’m not an audiophile, but after hearing Sonos at a friend’s house and being impressed, I decided to purchase a speaker for my kitchen, where I often listen to music while cooking. I opted for the Sonos Five, assuming that Bluetooth connectivity would be a standard feature on a standalone speaker, especially at this price point. To my surprise, a speaker costing nearly $600 doesn’t support Bluetooth—it only works via…

As someone that an Android user, and has been a user (and formerly, major fan) of Sonos for about ten years now, it honestly seems worse than that. For a while, Sonos speakers appeared as Google Cast targets, which was a phenomenal (if slightly overcomplicated) way to use them without opening up the Sonos app. Then, the cast functionality became really unreliable. Then, it just went away one day. Then, the Sonos app…

I'm not saying what they did was ok, but would it be possible to solder on a raspberry pi or something? Compared to other types of board rework, audio connections and DC power is relatively easy.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#112

Post by gosub100 »

chipgap98 wrote: post #54
Bhilai wrote: post #22

I’m not an audiophile, but after hearing Sonos at a friend’s house and being impressed, I decided to purchase a speaker for my kitchen, where I often listen to music while cooking. I opted for the Sonos Five, assuming that Bluetooth connectivity would be a standard feature on a standalone speaker, especially at this price point. To my surprise, a speaker costing nearly $600 doesn’t support Bluetooth—it only works via…

This seems like a strange gripe for this thread. That is something you could have looked up before purchasing the speaker. I also might be in the minority but I much prefer Wi-Fi streaming to Bluetooth in my house.

I agree with your last statement, because despite 20 years of development, they still haven't figured out how to get Bluetooth to work reliably. I don't think there's been a single other technology that has caused me more grief than it.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#113

Post by CharlesW »

cityzen wrote: post #70
fidotron wrote: post #7

My system has only been usable thanks to the efforts of a random German that wrote Sonophone; one guy outperforming a whole company. And Sonophone is very much "OK" in the sense it works, but it's got the strangest UI. This CEO, and his associated product management organisation, has completely destroyed all the goodwill that used to exist around Sonos, especially with respect to their ability to function almost enti…

There is also Soro on iPhone that works better than native app.

As background, the trouble started when they abandoned their native app for a Flutter rewrite. Flutter is not wholly to blame of course, but it's the reason the app feels weird and unreliable, and that in turn makes the hardware — and the company — feel weird and unreliable.

The first order of business should be to return to native app development, or at least adopt a platform (like React Native) that uses native controls.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#114

Post by cloudking »

davidu wrote: post #16

So what are people using instead of Sonos AMP for home sound control?

Chromecasts + HDMI stereos + Speaker Groups: https://support.google.com/chromecast/answer/7174267?hl=en

Works from Apple and Google mobile devices with Spotify

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#115

Post by nradov »

michaelt wrote: post #64
lenerdenator wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't really structure business law to allow for the appropriate amount of risk. The whole point of incorporation is to limit liability and shift what remains off of individuals at the company. If you try to change this, you'll hear screeching about how there's just too much risk and the "job creators" will just take their capital and ideas to more business-friendly legal climes.

Eh, even keeping the mechanism of limited-liability-corporations around, some would say boards aren't representing shareholders' interests effectively. It's one thing for shareholders to say if under the CEO's leadership, the company's value rises by 100 million dollars, they'll give him a $10 million bonus. I can see how a board could approve that - it's a lot of money, but it's linked to performance. But should the…

Boards will sometimes write a severance package into a CEO's contract with an eye towards a possible future sale. When the company is acquired, the CEO will most likely lose their job. The Board thus wants to ensure that the CEO doesn't have a financial incentive to block a sale. A good severance package can increase shareholder value. (This is just a comment about severance packages in general, I have no idea what happened at Sonos.)

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#116

Post by nradov »

lenerdenator wrote: post #41
awnird wrote: post #11

Patrick destroyed a successful company, and will be receiving millions of dollars on exit. His current replacement was an executive at the failed Quibi service. Nothing in tech will improve until there are actual consequences for people like this. Serial failures just hop from job to job. ruining products and lives along the way.

We don't really structure business law to allow for the appropriate amount of risk. The whole point of incorporation is to limit liability and shift what remains off of individuals at the company. If you try to change this, you'll hear screeching about how there's just too much risk and the "job creators" will just take their capital and ideas to more business-friendly legal climes.

What is the "appropriate amount of risk"? Please be specific. How do you quantify that? Should politicians decide that rather than shareholders, Board members, and management?

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#118

Post by lenerdenator »

nradov wrote: post #116
lenerdenator wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't really structure business law to allow for the appropriate amount of risk. The whole point of incorporation is to limit liability and shift what remains off of individuals at the company. If you try to change this, you'll hear screeching about how there's just too much risk and the "job creators" will just take their capital and ideas to more business-friendly legal climes.

What is the "appropriate amount of risk"? Please be specific. How do you quantify that? Should politicians decide that rather than shareholders, Board members, and management?

If I could answer that question to everyone's satisfaction, I'm not some rando on the internet.

But the justification for a lot of the incentives we give capital is "they shoulder all of the risk", and when your risk is walking away with a severance package that is often many multiples of the median lifetime earnings of the American male, you aren't really dealing with any real risk.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#119

Post by Arnt »

duxup wrote: post #58
amelius wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rewrite couldn't have caused this, because there was a single German developer who wrote a usable app, see this comment elsewhere [1]. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42683999

I think the article actually goes into detail why a rewrite does cause these things. The reasons matter.

Well, I've seen a rewrite that worked. The CEO used the software, including the signup processes. I've also seen a sequence of gradual changes that broke badly. Nobody in management used any part of the product.

I don't think being a rewrite is the important difference there, if you see what I mean.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#120

Post by wilsonnb3 »

DudeOpotomus wrote: post #36
davidu wrote: post #16

So what are people using instead of Sonos AMP for home sound control?

Apple airplay works flawlessly. Or you can buy an old Amazon fire and connect them to your own hardware. Both of these solutions allow you to use any speaker/amp setup you choose. And if you truly care about sound quality, this is the only path.

In my experience AirPlay 2 isn’t flawless, pretty much every time I try to use it there are stutters.

This is using an iPhone 16 Pro to AirPlay to a stereo pair of Sonos Five’s that are connected using Ethernet.

AirPlay isn’t a great choice if you are concerned about audio quality anyways - if you’re using AirPlay 2 you’re using 256kbps AAC, so it should sound the same as Bluetooth (or worse if you are comparing something like LDAC).

See here for more information.

https://darko.audio/2023/10/apple-airplay-isnt-always-lossle...

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