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Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

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Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#31

Post by sofixa »

Bhilai wrote: post #22

I’m not an audiophile, but after hearing Sonos at a friend’s house and being impressed, I decided to purchase a speaker for my kitchen, where I often listen to music while cooking. I opted for the Sonos Five, assuming that Bluetooth connectivity would be a standard feature on a standalone speaker, especially at this price point. To my surprise, a speaker costing nearly $600 doesn’t support Bluetooth—it only works via…

> If you’re an Android user, the limitations are even more frustrating. Playing music directly from YouTube isn’t possible without jumping through hoops

Unfortunately that's due to Google's bullshit. There's a lack of appropri APIs, that's why you'll notice that any "smart" audio device (by smart I mean, integrates directly with music streaming services/locally stored music) doesn't support YouTube nor YouTube Music.

Music Assistant (sister project to Home Assistant) supports it via hacks such as pretending to be a TV or copy pasting auth cookies.

It's frankly an embarrassment from Google not to have APIs for this, they only lose potential users.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#32

Post by applied_heat »

wnolens wrote: post #24

I also started investing in Sonos recently and damn the software is terrible. While I wish I could get 100% of my money back, I'm not sure there any turnkey alternative that is better. Every time I research I come back with "Sonos sucks but it's still the best".

What functionality did Sonos provide that you are after?

I use chromecast audio to play music throughout the house and it works great

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#33

Post by sjm-lbm »

Bhilai wrote: post #22

I’m not an audiophile, but after hearing Sonos at a friend’s house and being impressed, I decided to purchase a speaker for my kitchen, where I often listen to music while cooking. I opted for the Sonos Five, assuming that Bluetooth connectivity would be a standard feature on a standalone speaker, especially at this price point. To my surprise, a speaker costing nearly $600 doesn’t support Bluetooth—it only works via…

As someone that an Android user, and has been a user (and formerly, major fan) of Sonos for about ten years now, it honestly seems worse than that. For a while, Sonos speakers appeared as Google Cast targets, which was a phenomenal (if slightly overcomplicated) way to use them without opening up the Sonos app. Then, the cast functionality became really unreliable. Then, it just went away one day. Then, the Sonos app itself became basically unusable.

So, a decade or so ago, I spent $1k+ on speakers. Over time, due to software changes, they've become more or less unusable for me. My recourse on this is.. pretty much nothing.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#34

Post by schnable »

lawn wrote: post #12

We have a Sonos speaker in the Kitchen and I'm so done with it. We're going to renovate our kitchen in a few months and I plan to install a pair of speakers in the roof and hook them up to a Raspberry Pi with a Hifiberry amp and the HifiberryOS. I'm sure there will be issues but at least I'll be free of Sonos.

Check out Wiim. A few amp options that are half the price of Sonos.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#35

Post by duxup »

kitsune_ wrote: post #6

Given the number of poor product managers and product owners I've encountered in my career - those who don't seem to care at all about end users or people in general - I'm surprised incidents like this don't happen more frequently.

I think for some (not all) folks writing code there is a sort of built in "this should actually work" mentality and that keeps A LOT of things running.

Granted not all, I've worked with some widget makers who would rather just take tasks, do EXACTLY what it says, and move on regardless if it works or not. They love the certainty of process and want to just do that.

Steve Jobs ran into that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4Cz49MLh4o

Granted as Steve mentioned, people worried about the end result are more work to deal with.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#36

Post by DudeOpotomus »

davidu wrote: post #16

So what are people using instead of Sonos AMP for home sound control?

Apple airplay works flawlessly. Or you can buy an old Amazon fire and connect them to your own hardware.

Both of these solutions allow you to use any speaker/amp setup you choose. And if you truly care about sound quality, this is the only path.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#37

Post by sofixa »

wnolens wrote: post #24

I also started investing in Sonos recently and damn the software is terrible. While I wish I could get 100% of my money back, I'm not sure there any turnkey alternative that is better. Every time I research I come back with "Sonos sucks but it's still the best".

It's still early days in my use, but I've been quite happy with AudioPro (yeah, shitty name). Their devices look nice, sound really good, support a variety of protocols and integrate with a ton of steaming services directly (but you don't have to because you can just Bluetooth/Cast/Airplay/AUX to them). Their app is a tad ugly but it does everything I need it to.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#39

Post by sergioisidoro »

duxup wrote: post #19

They violated the "Things You Should Never Do, Part I" rule: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/04/06/things-you-should-... It's such a TEMPTING rule to violate... The amazing part was how BAD it went, supposedly engineers were raising every red flag possible that it wasn't ready and still they did it. Considering how bad it was I can't imagine having any faith in anyone up the chain of command having the power, or…

Basecamp violates that rule often and they are doing ok. If I remember right they even make it a strategy to re-write their whole application every few years.

There's no hard rules in software engineering, and all best practices should be put into context. You don't know what monsters lurked in the old code base. So yes in some cases (but not often) re-write is a good / only choice.

Re: Sonos CEO Patrick Spence steps down after disastrous app launch

#40

Post by mattgreenrocks »

duxup wrote: post #35
kitsune_ wrote: post #6

Given the number of poor product managers and product owners I've encountered in my career - those who don't seem to care at all about end users or people in general - I'm surprised incidents like this don't happen more frequently.

I think for some (not all) folks writing code there is a sort of built in "this should actually work" mentality and that keeps A LOT of things running. Granted not all, I've worked with some widget makers who would rather just take tasks, do EXACTLY what it says, and move on regardless if it works or not. They love the certainty of process and want to just do that. Steve Jobs ran into that: https://www.youtube.com/wa…

Actually building things keeps you humble in a way that’s hard to articulate. You’re constantly contending with reality, not models/processes whose purpose is to smooth over things to present a facade of order.
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