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Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

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Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#61

Post by andrewvc »

dignan wrote: post #24
andrewvc wrote: post #2

The problem I have here is price. This just doesn't undercut an mbp, and it would have to to get me to buy it

Maybe you're not the target audience then? This seems to be targeted at a relatively specific group of people.

Perhaps. I've run linux year over year til 6 mo. ago when I switched to a mac.

As nice as this is I just doubt the hardware is of a similar quality. Additionally, for a notebook the magsafe connector is a huge deal as it's the thing I've seen die first on notebook after notebook.

I do all my dev on linux VMs at this point, and I'd imagine that's a lot of other devs.

Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#62

Post by dllthomas »

l0nk wrote: post #34
dllthomas wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that the big problem is that the pre-loaded crapware on a Windows PC pays more than Windows costs (in bulk license deals for resellers). In that case just selling it with a wiped disk would be more expensive, not less.

Hi, I lived in China (Dalian), and laptops are sold with FreeDOS. It's mainly used to boot and to make sure the laptop is working. And to check that you get what you paid for! People who can pay for Windows don't live in China, that's why :) (well of course a minority can, but they don't buy their laptops in the same stores...). In US/CA/EU/Japan I think everybody can afford to pay the little extra for a windows lice…

Sure I can afford to pay a little extra for a windows license, but why on earth should I be expected to "pay a little extra" for something I'm not going to use?

My point above, however, was that I might not be paying extra - the crapware pushers might be subsidizing my linux box (with an extraneous tithe to MS).

Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#63

Post by zanny »

joezydeco wrote: post #50
user49598 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The majority of new laptops work out of the box with ubuntu 12.04. The driver complaint, while still fair in many cases, is not nearly as relevant as it used to be. Peripherals can be tough, but built-in hardware has come a long way. Also, IMHO, weather dell is doing exactly what you want or not, they are continuing to support freedom of choice, freedom of software, and the hacker community in general. I commend them…

So, and I'm honestly curious here because I'm in the market, what is the best Linux laptop out there? I hear people swoon over a particular Lenovo/Thinkpad model, but have no idea which one it is.

I put it on a relatives Toshiba Satellite. 99% of laptop models are going to be fine with Linux, unless they start implementing secure boot. Drivers wise, the embedded cameras and microphones they put in laptops almost always are from a maker that already has some form of Linux driver.

Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#64

Post by dllthomas »

praxulus wrote: post #29
dllthomas wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that the big problem is that the pre-loaded crapware on a Windows PC pays more than Windows costs (in bulk license deals for resellers). In that case just selling it with a wiped disk would be more expensive, not less.

I have also heard this. If you're going to install something new anyway, you're just letting them subsidize your new computer. I don't have a problem with this.

Directly, I have a little bit of a problem with MS collecting money when they're not adding anything to the situation. That said, I have less of a problem than if it was my money, and still less of a problem given that I don't exactly have a lot of love for the organizations whose money it is.

Indirectly, I have a somewhat larger problem because it leads to things like fewer cheap Linux laptops available.

Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#65

Post by shimon_e »

l0nk wrote: post #34
dllthomas wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that the big problem is that the pre-loaded crapware on a Windows PC pays more than Windows costs (in bulk license deals for resellers). In that case just selling it with a wiped disk would be more expensive, not less.

Hi, I lived in China (Dalian), and laptops are sold with FreeDOS. It's mainly used to boot and to make sure the laptop is working. And to check that you get what you paid for! People who can pay for Windows don't live in China, that's why :) (well of course a minority can, but they don't buy their laptops in the same stores...). In US/CA/EU/Japan I think everybody can afford to pay the little extra for a windows lice…

I spend much of the year in China and I find the laptops overpriced or underpowered for the price they are offered for.

Sure, comparing retail price in China to the west usually has China being lower. However, most savvy buyers in the west buy their laptops from deals or outlet and with endless coupons. I haven't found either Dell's or Lenovo's outlet in China yet. Do they exist in China?

Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#66

Post by sigkill »

joezydeco wrote: post #50
user49598 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The majority of new laptops work out of the box with ubuntu 12.04. The driver complaint, while still fair in many cases, is not nearly as relevant as it used to be. Peripherals can be tough, but built-in hardware has come a long way. Also, IMHO, weather dell is doing exactly what you want or not, they are continuing to support freedom of choice, freedom of software, and the hacker community in general. I commend them…

So, and I'm honestly curious here because I'm in the market, what is the best Linux laptop out there? I hear people swoon over a particular Lenovo/Thinkpad model, but have no idea which one it is.

I bought a generic run of the mill but powerful Sager NP8662 3 years ago. It's a Clevo, and other than the fingerprint reader, I don't need any other custom drivers on Ubuntu. Even the bloody webcam and card reader work out of the box on 12.04, which I'm extremely surprised since I have to install manually drivers on Windows 7.

I'd say, if you have the money to spend buy an OEM laptop.

Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#67

Post by dfrey »

user49598 wrote: post #41
dfrey wrote: post #33

When Dell sold Linux laptops before, the problem was always that they treated the Linux version and the Windows version as a separate SKU. So you were buying the Dell Latitude 4100 Linux version or the Dell Latitude 4100 Windows version. You couldn't just go to the Dell Latitude 4100 web page and select Windows or Linux from the Operating System drop-down menu. The regular price of the Windows version would be $1000…

Bummer, but not a problem. They are different products targeting different markets. You don't want users being able to switch between windows or linux pre-installed via a simple interface. You want them to know exactly what they're doing. (Or in case they don't know what they're doing, you want them to buy windows) Dell also needs to be able to promote their laptops using features of the OS, or software that comes wi…

I definitely think that Dell is in a tough position in that they must protect themselves against customers that are dumb enough to choose an operating system that they don't want.

I disagree with your suggestion to buy the Windows version if it's cheaper. It's frustrating to me to see the $1000 Windows laptop marked down to $900 and the Linux one be sold at the original price of $930. I want to buy the Linux version for $830, not the Windows one for $900 :)

In truth, the first thing I would do after buying a Dell Laptop with Linux installed is wipe it clean and install Linux with the settings that I prefer. So the value of the preinstalled Linux for me is really just that I know that the hardware is all supported under Linux and I'm not paying for an OS that I don't want.

Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#69

Post by rch »

tikhonj wrote: post #55
sbi wrote: post #36

What is the battery life going to be like? I grudgingly installed Windows 7 on my (Lenovo) laptop after using Unix exclusively for 15 years simply because the battery lasts twice as long on Windows. For what it's worth, I bought a Dell Inspiron Mini 10v with Ubuntu Hardy preinstalled 2.5 years ago. It didn't suspend/resume properly and video out was flaky. It died after two years of use (with strange electrical probl…

I think the recent kernels have had improved power management. I've certainly noticed an improvement on my laptop running Fedora a while back.

Which laptop? I desperately want to replace my MBP with the highest quality Fedora-supporting hardware I can find.

Re: Ubuntu is coming back to Dell Laptops

#70

Post by rch »

acdanger wrote: post #10
acabal wrote: post #3

This is a good idea in theory but potentially bad in execution. What I'd like (and I suspect many other developers would too) is a nice laptop that I can install Linux on, and have it Just Work. What it looks like Dell is providing is a nice laptop, but with a custom build of Ubuntu installed. If Dell's Windows installs are any indication, that means it's going to be loaded with crapware or custom non-OSS drivers. Th…

I'm wondering if these might be a better route than what Dell is proposing: http://zareason.com/shop/Laptops/

Thanks for this link - I have been searching for hardware along these lines for quite some time.
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