This sprang instantly to mind.
Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
161–170 of 221 posts
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#162Earlier quoted context omitted.
Useful it may be, but after more than 10 years of having to work with Oracle products and consultants, the first thing that jumped at me was ...doesn't Oracle Linux cost money? A: Oracle Linux support costs money That "support" word, right there, is the thing that makes me stay as far from Oracle as I can. It's like "Dude, here's the software. Have it, it's cheap/free." When things go wrong you get stung for exorbita…
Uhh, you know RHEL costs money too? A lot of money.
If you're using Oracle, the cost of RHEL is a trivial factor.
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#163Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think I've ever espoused that opinion! I like CentOS a lot. I had a beer with Karanbir in London in 2009, and I'm totally impressed that they're able to put out an incredibly popular Linux distribution with next to nothing, resource-wise. But if I were a sysadmin, would I run CentOS in production? Is CentOS perfect? I'd say no on both counts, and I think there's nothing wrong with saying "There's room for imp…
but at what price? at the price of losing centos because oracle are a predatory monster driven solely by greed? put it another, more constructive way: wouldn't it be better to help centos rather than try to kill them? why not take that route?
I'm having problems with seeing why CentOS may cease as a result of this move from Oracle and Mr Daher.
CentOS is free, so as long as the sponsors continue to sponsor the work on CentOS and as long as whoever pays for the servers &c continues to do so, the project can continue.
Scientific Linux and PUIAS exist for other reasons than commercial server provisioning and those reasons will probably stay around.
The CentOS and Scientific Linux forums contain useful information, the mailing lists contain more technical information. Oracle won't to my knowledge be providing self-help forums or other community features as they wish to package support as a product. I can imagine Oracle Linux users who do not require support dropping into, posting to and contributing to the CentOS and SciLi forums.
How will CentOS (or another clone) be impacted to the point of extinction by Oracle Linux? Am I being dense here?
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#164Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's a ton to talk about in the "Why Oracle Linux and not RHEL" department, but I'm not trying to sell you anything, so I want to set that aside for now. (I have to say, though, even the "big price tag" is significantly smaller than RHEL's). Instead, I want to look at the following case: you're a sysadmin running CentOS. You don't pay anyone for support, and you have no intention of ever doing so. There, I think t…
I dont get why your QA is better than red hats. They have a much longer experience with their product.
It's cheaper.
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#165Earlier quoted context omitted.
(Disclaimer: I had a hand in a lot of this) That's not quite the intent. Look, here's the deal: I know we all like to think that corporations are evil and the presence of corporate interests actually messes stuff up. But this really is one case where you want the oomph of bilion-dollar company making sure that you get your security updates in time. No one else is providing that. Oracle happens to be doing so, and we'…
Anyone decrying Oracle as "evil" is falling into a trap that I have warned about[1]: they are making the mistake of anthropomorphizing Larry Ellison -- they are infusing Oracle with humanity that it does not in fact have. Oracle is, as another commenter put it, a corporate sociopath. The inability to empathize is fine for a monopolist (and indeed, it's a terrific asset -- and after five months of working there, I con…
The fate of OpenSolaris is quite sad. Do you think SmartOS and similar efforts will significantly diverge from Solaris in the future?
This thing with Oracle Linux - I always felt that Red Hat should've made RHEL (+ Desktop) freely available (including updates) since the beginning.
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#166Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think that's an accurate summary. And I think the point that you can always switch back to CentOS or Scientific Linux is an important one. Ultimately, this is a topic where a lot of people have religious devotion, so for me it's really a question of whether pragmatism outweighs zealotry.
So there are migrate-away scripts, too? I suppose they wouldn't be very hard to do (essentially drop Oracle specific packages, and point yum to the original repos).
There isn't a reverse script yet, but you're right, making one would be fairly straightforward.
'--reverse' is something I'd like to see implemented, though, if nothing else because it'll assuage people's fears, and makes it feel less risky to experiment.
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#167Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I know we all like to think that corporations are evil and the presence of corporate interests actually messes stuff up. But Oracle actually is evil . > But this really is one case where you want the oomph of bilion-dollar company making sure that you get your security updates in time. Don't be naive, Oracle wouldn't be doing this if they didn't see a substantial business advantage. > No one else is providing that.…
But Oracle actually is evil. Evil is stomping a kitten to death. Evil is the gulag, the concentration camp, the cultural revolution. Oracle is just a business.
"Oracle is just a business."
True, and one that exists to maximise shareholder value. Alas, that aim may not contribute positively to the larger picture, hence various forms of regulation that exist in many countries.
This is an issue too large for this particular page.
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#168Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is the exact same feeling that I'm getting from this announcement. To me this just feels like a publicity stunt, where Oracle is aiming to get a slice of the CentOS/RHEL market with very little investment. As far as I'm concerned this isn't even a valid attempt on their behalf to earn the trust of the Open Source Community. Taking something that already works and touting your own horn about how you can provide f…
I was trying to go for a "for linux nerds, by linux nerds" vibe, so I'm amused that your complaint is "This doesn't sound corporate enough". At the end of the day, my view here is that Oracle has actually produced something useful, but lots of people are blind to it, in no small part because of what ultimately boils down to zealotry (which doesn't seem like an awesome reason to me). Hence the point of trying to get t…
How did it come to this? I mean, did it require lobbying to achieve this, or was it sunshine and rainbows all the way?
For my part, I think this is a good effort.
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#169Earlier quoted context omitted.
(Disclaimer: I had a hand in a lot of this) That's not quite the intent. Look, here's the deal: I know we all like to think that corporations are evil and the presence of corporate interests actually messes stuff up. But this really is one case where you want the oomph of bilion-dollar company making sure that you get your security updates in time. No one else is providing that. Oracle happens to be doing so, and we'…
You are saying that Oracle's goal is to make sure that CentOS customers can access the resources of a billion dollar company in order to get security patches on time. If that were all that was going on, then Oracle would just provide funding and engineering support to CentOS. Since you aren't doing that, one of two things must be happening: 1. This is part of a long term strategy, which means it will somehow make a p…
"We do want big companies behind the Linux ecosystem. There are already many out there (Red Hat, Canonical, among them) doing just that."
Canonical isn't that big on a scale of Red Hat, and is rounding error on a scale of Oracle. They punch well above their financial weight and good luck to them
Re: Oracle launches "a better alternative to CentOS"
#170Earlier quoted context omitted.
but at what price? at the price of losing centos because oracle are a predatory monster driven solely by greed? put it another, more constructive way: wouldn't it be better to help centos rather than try to kill them? why not take that route?
Most users of either one will likely not contribute anything at all back besides simply being part of the "network effects". I'm not a fan of Oracle either, but your rhetoric is in the red zone...
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