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Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

pimosa.app

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Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#141

Post by rhubarbtree »

adastra22 wrote: post #52
kyrra wrote: post #50

May I suggest not offering lifetime updates? All software that does this ends up getting around it in the end because they realize they need to get more money from existing customers to actually stay afloat. Normally by releasing the product under a slightly different name or some other sleight of hand. The model like jetbrains does with IntelliJ I think is decent. Or look at smaller software like sublime text or Arq…

Maybe I'm old school, but I won't "buy" (rent?) subscriptions for software. I expect to own it outright, at to receive at least security updates for a reasonable time period.

I just don't think the old model of "one shot" software works. Firstly, security updates. Next, dependencies change over time and you want the software to still work. Third, adding new features and keeping it integrated with the OS / UI kits etc. requires ongoing work.

In theory you could have a single binary that never changes, ever, but it's just unrealistic.

Subscription models are fine, Jetbrains is the fallback if you're going to be super adamant about refusing to fund ongoing development, but software is not like other products. Maybe in the past when it was very simple within a simple ecosystem it was different.

There's something to be said for reducing the pricing to something more sustainable and more explicity upstream donations, but "pay once, have the developer continue to work for me for free if I keep it long enough" isn't realistic.

Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#142

Post by bennythomsson »

criddell wrote: post #136
rq1 wrote: post #135

I’ll try to not be dismissive of the labour, though it’s kind of funny (or actually natural) that the heavy lifting libraries that only a few can actually write are open and free, while the shallow wrappers that everyone can write are paid and closed. Decades ago we were calling out these software and now it’s the norm. Another example along the line: I wanted to extract a frame from a video on iOS, it’s impossible w…

I think you are underestimating how difficult making a great UI is (although I haven’t used this application so I can’t say if it’s great or not).

And you might be underestimating the work that went into those libraries.

We are talking decades of work, dealing with platform issues, performance, loads of security considerations and then there is the whole licensing+patent topic.

Sure UI work is hard, but of the whole package, it's only the visible part of the iceberg and now I'm expected to give $30 to the person who only contributed that last piece? Of course it's work too but if not at least half that money is being donated to the underlying FOSS projects then I'm out.

Another suggestion: open source your app. Those who don't know how to compile/build it, or are too lazy, which will be most, they can pay for the convenience, and you'll have the income you expect, but at least you are giving back to the community on whose work you are basing yours.

> self-taught full-stack developer who wrote the first line of code in the 2020 Corona lockdown.

You my friend are standing on the shoulders of giants. Time to ack them.

Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#143

Post by rane »

newusertoday wrote: post #38

how are you able to get around ffmpeg licensing since it is client app which requires you to open your code if you use ffmpeg GPL?

It doesn't if you use it as a bundled binary.

https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/4008/can-i-us...

https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/5188/software...

Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#144

Post by justmarc »

adastra22 wrote: post #112
thfuran wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you expect to receive a free car every new model year after buying one outright?

My car comes with free recall servicing (security updates) and a manufacturer warranty.

I bet this doesn't come from the kindness of car manufacturers, but through laws and regulations requiring that.

We probably don't have any of that with software, yet.

Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#145

Post by lovasoa »

criddell wrote: post #136
rq1 wrote: post #135

I’ll try to not be dismissive of the labour, though it’s kind of funny (or actually natural) that the heavy lifting libraries that only a few can actually write are open and free, while the shallow wrappers that everyone can write are paid and closed. Decades ago we were calling out these software and now it’s the norm. Another example along the line: I wanted to extract a frame from a video on iOS, it’s impossible w…

I think you are underestimating how difficult making a great UI is (although I haven’t used this application so I can’t say if it’s great or not).

Making a good user interface is definitely not easy. Yet it's orders of magnitude easier than writing ffmpeg.

That said, there is nothing wrong with a paid wrapper around a large and complex open source library. Distributing their work more widely is not a disservice.

Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#146

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

lagrange77 wrote: post #137
rq1 wrote: post #135

I’ll try to not be dismissive of the labour, though it’s kind of funny (or actually natural) that the heavy lifting libraries that only a few can actually write are open and free, while the shallow wrappers that everyone can write are paid and closed. Decades ago we were calling out these software and now it’s the norm. Another example along the line: I wanted to extract a frame from a video on iOS, it’s impossible w…

While i'm with you in principle, over the years i've learned that we should not talk down good UI/UX, if that's what the wrapper adds. It's a crucial component to the value of a piece of software for the end user.

This is true.

I have seen absolutely miraculous backends, totally pooched, because the library developer thought that GUI was for "wusses."

Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#147

Post by bennythomsson »

lagrange77 wrote: post #137
rq1 wrote: post #135

I’ll try to not be dismissive of the labour, though it’s kind of funny (or actually natural) that the heavy lifting libraries that only a few can actually write are open and free, while the shallow wrappers that everyone can write are paid and closed. Decades ago we were calling out these software and now it’s the norm. Another example along the line: I wanted to extract a frame from a video on iOS, it’s impossible w…

While i'm with you in principle, over the years i've learned that we should not talk down good UI/UX, if that's what the wrapper adds. It's a crucial component to the value of a piece of software for the end user.

He actually himself writes that he doesn't want to spend too much time on his apps:

> now i have lession that i shouldnt build apps that consumes so much time.

Sounds like somebody really devoted to the perfect UI experience.

Look, I don't want to talk down this kid. Everybody starts somewhere and I like the enthusiasm. But him expecting to make $30 off everybody for plumbing together a bunch of FOSS libs is rubbing me the wrong way.

Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#148

Post by p4bl0 »

rq1 wrote: post #135

I’ll try to not be dismissive of the labour, though it’s kind of funny (or actually natural) that the heavy lifting libraries that only a few can actually write are open and free, while the shallow wrappers that everyone can write are paid and closed. Decades ago we were calling out these software and now it’s the norm. Another example along the line: I wanted to extract a frame from a video on iOS, it’s impossible w…

Upvoting you because my comment saying the same thing is getting downvotes and I really think the message is important.

However I don't think it's fair to call this a "shallow wrapper". It's clear that a lot of work went into the design of this GUI and, and making user-friendly interfaces is also an important work (that is far too often overlooked in the open sources communities).

Yet the fact that FFmpeg, the tool that does all the heavy background work, isn't even mentioned anywhere on the website, even in the FAQ or the footer is at least a non-negligible ethical problem.

UPDATE: The same goes for ImageMagick that I just saw this app installs and uses too.

Re: Show HN: I completed shipping my desktop app

#149

Post by bennythomsson »

kyrra wrote: post #50

May I suggest not offering lifetime updates? All software that does this ends up getting around it in the end because they realize they need to get more money from existing customers to actually stay afloat. Normally by releasing the product under a slightly different name or some other sleight of hand. The model like jetbrains does with IntelliJ I think is decent. Or look at smaller software like sublime text or Arq…

The explanation is that this will be abandonware pretty soon after he moved on and made enough $$$ off this project.

Just read his webpage, it's quite obvious.

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