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China is the manufacturing superpower

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Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#121

Post by fakedang »

bigfatkitten wrote: post #107
grecy wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, I’m an Aussie who went back during covid for the first meaningful stretch in 20 years. Explored the who country. I saw with my own eyes what you’re talking about and you are spot on. It’s depressing and sad to see how Australia can’t organize a free one in a brothel, is stuck in the past and has no real interest or plan on how to improve anything at all. Their problem is life is pretty good, so they’re not inte…

David Horne said it best in 1964. "Australia is a lucky country run mainly by second rate people who share its luck. It lives on other people’s ideas, and, although its ordinary people are adaptable, most of its leaders (in all fields) so lack curiosity about the events that surround them that they are often taken by surprise."

That's such a beautifully relevant quote.

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#122

Post by fakedang »

grecy wrote: post #90
fakedang wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't help but say that Australia is basically the stupidest country on the planet (at least amongst Western democracies, since one could say modern Russia is stupider, but that's a whole another cultural debate). It's like the degenerate alcoholic who's willing to prostitute their mother for a bar tab. A country so blessed with some of the most important natural resources, a country whose geography is synonymous w…

FWIW, I’m an Aussie who went back during covid for the first meaningful stretch in 20 years. Explored the who country. I saw with my own eyes what you’re talking about and you are spot on. It’s depressing and sad to see how Australia can’t organize a free one in a brothel, is stuck in the past and has no real interest or plan on how to improve anything at all. Their problem is life is pretty good, so they’re not inte…

It's what they call the resource curse, something that has plagued Norway too, but at least in Norway's case, they have opted to do it in a way that sustains it for the future. Compared to the Swedish and Danish, the Norwegians are also considered lazy for the same reason - life is good, so why bother with ambition?

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#123

Post by Yeul »

mahirsaid wrote: post #73

this is amazing and filled with facts that i wish everyone arguing the point that china cant overtake U.S. in economy or world superpowers would read. The facts are there, there is not much hiding around the corner, all of the true indication is in front of us. Yes. the article states U.S. still holds the title for world superpower by military size and capabilities. That's not to say that china cant catch up in no ti…

Trump reminds me of a Star Wars quote

"The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers"

The reality is that China will not magically disappear and they have integrated themselves into the world economy.

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#124

Post by fakedang »

defrost wrote: post #39
fakedang wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't help but say that Australia is basically the stupidest country on the planet (at least amongst Western democracies, since one could say modern Russia is stupider, but that's a whole another cultural debate). It's like the degenerate alcoholic who's willing to prostitute their mother for a bar tab. A country so blessed with some of the most important natural resources, a country whose geography is synonymous w…

> Australia is basically the stupidest country on the planet Too right. > It's like the degenerate alcoholic who's willing to prostitute their mother for a bar tab. Ahh, so you are Australian then. > even if they are from their biggest regional rivals. How is China a regional rival ? Australia has koalas, China has Pandas. > While Norway and the UAE enjoy the fruits of their resources through strong welfare systems e…

> Australia also has welfare, high living standards, high life expectancy, good health, etc.

Tell me how affordable a home near the workplace is for most Australians? On the contrary, Norwegians and Emiratis get a huge housing subsidy for their first homes. They both use their oil revenues to push for sustainable energy sources at home. And the UAE is currently pulling over its weight in AI, funding a significant AI player, while also taking part in active space exploration.

> Ahhh, so Norway and UAE have their own home built computers, TV's, and EV's, etc then?

Building computers, EVs and TVs in this age when China controls the complete manufacturing chain is a bit stupid honestly. But they do have manufacturing bases on the things they actually excel at - Norway is a major player in manufacturing shipping and specialized O&G equipment, while the UAE has focused on aircraft parts manufacturing and defence manufacturing.

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#125

Post by fakedang »

maxglute wrote: post #77
fakedang wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't help but say that Australia is basically the stupidest country on the planet (at least amongst Western democracies, since one could say modern Russia is stupider, but that's a whole another cultural debate). It's like the degenerate alcoholic who's willing to prostitute their mother for a bar tab. A country so blessed with some of the most important natural resources, a country whose geography is synonymous w…

AU exported ~1.5-2 trillion (lazy chatgpt math) worth of iron ore to PRC in last 20 years... which is life changing sovereign fund size, for Norway (also ~2T), with 5 million people. Or UAE 1 million emraties. Qatar with 300k Qataries. Much less so for 25m OZs. Doesn't mean they haven't squandered what they have, but just to put scale in perspective. Not to mention PRC steel employs like 3m people, about the entire p…

Like I mentioned in another comment, you create manufacturing companies in your home turf to refine those raw materials into higher value products, which is exactly what Norway, the UAE and Saudi Arabia have done (Qatar cant exactly do that because their resource is basically just gas). Companies like Aramco, SABIC, ADNOC and Statoil exist. I don't see any of those countries inviting Adani or Yuxiao to extract their material for them. Yet China is a major customer for all of them, as they all are for China (Norway maybe less so).

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#126

Post by manishader »

ted_bunny wrote: post #116
bobthepanda wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think it’s necessarily so clear that Chinese foreign policy has really paid off yet. Chinese loanmaking to foreign countries has mostly gone bust, with many loans basically in default. While it’s true that Western development agencies were not lending to these projects, they mostly weren’t doing so because they were doubtful of the business cases of said projects and the likelihood that the government could a…

It's been argued that if you observe actions and not words, default has always been the point of IMF loans. Have you read Confessions of an Economic Hitman?

If you can't tell Confessions of an Economic Hitman is a work of fiction I don't know what to tell you.

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#127

Post by manishader »

Hilift wrote: post #68
advael wrote: post #3

Huh. For all the claims that US manufacturing is down, it does seem that if we adjusted per-capita it's on par with China based on the figures presented here, which I really didn't expect to see I'm no expert and of course I have no clue if it even makes sense to measure per-capita manufacturing share, and also assume a lot of other factors matter here - what kinds of things we're manufacturing, how much those produc…

Some manufacturing is down. Look at the state of sophisticated shipbuilding. The US Navy has stated numerous times that the US essentially has minimal capacity. Maintenance and construction are years behind schedule. It isn't about funding. 40% of attack submarines aren't fit for service or deployable. The new Columbia class submarine will use a new steam turbine. Northrup Grumman was selected for the manufacture of…

There is also the USS Zumwalt type problem.

We spent $22.5 billion to get two active.

Imagine what $22.5 billion USD buys in Chinese manufacturing capacity.

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#128

Post by manishader »

pm90 wrote: post #48
coliveira wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Even if China was 100% a friend, you wouldn't want one country with this much outsized control over manufacturing It's not up to the US to decide this. China is the largest car market. It is also the largest car producing country. It is the largest manufacturing country. It also has the largest number of consumers in any country, and this market is still growing. It has the largest number of engineers. The numbers…

Certainly. The reality of the political situation though is that China is an authoritarian country ruled by the PRC, increasingly acting more like a dictatorship. While China’s economy, society and people have 100% the right to grow as much as they would like, those of us living in (sonewhat) liberal democracies would still want to contain the power of the PRC (and the cult of Xi Jinping).

If 1989 had gone in a different direction and China today is just a giant version of Taiwan, how would that possibly be better as an American? We would all be trying to figure out how to get paid in digital Yuan.

Instead they have huge manufacturing capacity sitting on top of a completely busted financial system. Look at the returns of Chinese equities vs GDP growth the last 20 years. It is completely absurd.

The financial system is imploding right now, trying to find a place to hide https://tradingeconomics.com/china/government-bond-yield

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#129

Post by metalman »

my favorite bit of trivia connected with the whole "trade war" is the sudden apearance in China, of companies devoted to the making labels, the most poular (currently) are those saying "made in vietnam" and apocryaphal or not?, there is a city in china named USA, which satisfied the beurocratic requirements of some other round of protectionism

Re: China is the manufacturing superpower

#130

Post by kriops »

wakawaka28 wrote: post #101
kriops wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A reduction in the space of possible allocations of resources isn’t good. It is good for any particular set of parties insofar as it hurts some other set of parties more than themselves. This is neither complicated nor controversial.

>A reduction in the space of possible allocations of resources isn’t good. I would personally like to eliminate allocations of resources that put me out of business and wreck the country. >It is good for any particular set of parties insofar as it hurts some other set of parties more than themselves. There's a huge misunderstanding in here somewhere. Most people don't think of their own welfare in terms of a negative…

To the second half: If some other party seeks to hurt you, it is in your best interest to prevent them from doing so. Especially if the cost is less than the harm they would inflict. Presuming peaceful coexistence, then it is not in anyone's interest to limit anything beyond the basic idea of 'my freedom ends where your begins'.
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