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OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

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Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#481
post #267

When the source code for these LLMs gets leaked, I expect to see: def letter_count(string, letter): if string == “strawberry” and letter == “r”: return 3 …

In of their release videos for the o1 -preview model they _admitted_ that it's hardcoded in.

Honestly I'm concerned how hacked up o3 is to secure a high benchmark score.

Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#482

This is so impressive that it brings out the pessimist in me. Hopefully my skepticism will end up being unwarranted, but how confident are we that the queries are not routed to human workers behind the API? This sounds crazy but is plausible for the fake-it-till-you-make-it crowd. Also given the prohibitive compute costs per task, typical users won't be using this model, so the scheme could go on for quite sometime b…

this is an impressive tinfoil take. but what would be their plan in the medium term? like once they release this people can check their data

Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#483
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the other is that there was an approach that made the task easier than we expected. from reading Dennett's philosophy, I'm convinced that that's how human intelligence works - for each task that "only a human could do that", there's a trick that makes it easier than it seems. We are bags of tricks.

> We are bags of tricks. We are trick generators, that is what it means to be a general intelligence. Adding another trick in the bag doesn't make you a general intelligence, being able to discover and add new tricks yourself makes you a general intelligence.

Not the parent, but remembering my reading of Dennett, he was referring to the tricks that we got through evolution, rather than ones we invented ourselves. As particular examples, we have neural functional areas for capabilities like facial recognition and spatial reasoning which seems to rely on dedicated "wetware" somewhat distinct from other parts of the brain.

Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#484
Nadella is a superb CEO, inarguably among the best of his generation. He believed in OpenAI when no one else did and deserves acclaim for this brilliant investment.

But his "below them, above them, around them" quote on OpenAI may haunt him in 2025/2026.

OAI or someone else will approach AGI-like capabilities (however nebulous the term), fostering the conditions to contest Microsoft's straitjacket.

Of course, OAI is hemorrhaging cash and may fail to create a sustainable business without GPU credits, but the possibility of OAI escaping Microsoft's grasp grows by the day.

Coupled with research and hardware trends, OAI's product strategy suggests the probability of a sustainable business within 1-3 years is far from certain but also higher than commonly believed.

If OAI becomes a $200b+ independent company, it would be against incredible odds given the intense competition and the Microsoft deal. PG's cannibal quote about Altman feels so apt.

It will be fascinating to see how this unfolds.

Congrats to OAI on yet another fantastic release.

Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#486

This is so impressive that it brings out the pessimist in me. Hopefully my skepticism will end up being unwarranted, but how confident are we that the queries are not routed to human workers behind the API? This sounds crazy but is plausible for the fake-it-till-you-make-it crowd. Also given the prohibitive compute costs per task, typical users won't be using this model, so the scheme could go on for quite sometime b…

I'm very confident that queries were not routed to human workers behind the API.

Possibly some other form of "make it seem more impressive than it is," but not that one.

Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#487
post #111
post #93

The programming task they gave o3-mini high (creating Python server that allows chatting with OpenAI API and run some code in terminal) didn't seem very hard? Strange choice of example for something that's claimed to be a big step forwards. YT timestamped link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKBG1sqdyIU&t=768s (thanks for the fixed link @photonboom) Updated: I gave the task to Claude 3.5 Sonnet and it worked first s…

I would say they didn’t need to demo anything, because if you are gonna use the output code live on a demo it may make compile errors and then look stupid trying to fix it live

Models are predictable at 0 temperatures. They might have tested the output beforehand.

Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#488

Let me go against some skeptics and explain why I think full o3 is pretty much AGI or at least embodies most essential aspects of AGI. What has been lacking so far in frontier LLMs is the ability to reliably deal with the right level of abstraction for a given problem. Reasoning is useful but often comes out lacking if one cannot reason at the right level of abstraction. (Note that many humans can't either when they…

Have we really watered down the definition of AGI that much?

LLMs aren't really capable of "learning" anything outside their training data. Which I feel is a very basic and fundamental capability of humans.

Every new request thread is a blank slate utilizing whatever context you provide for the specific task and after the tread is done (or context limit runs out) it's like it never happened. Sure you can use databases, do web queries, etc. but these are inflexible bandaid solutions, far from what's needed for AGI.

Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#489

Congratulations to Francois Chollet on making the most interesting and challenging LLM benchmark so far. A lot of people have criticized ARC as not being relevant or indicative of true reasoning, but I think it was exactly the right thing. The fact that scaled reasoning models are finally showing progress on ARC proves that what it measures really is relevant and important for reasoning. It's obvious to everyone that…

It's the least interesting benchmark for language models among all they've released, especially now that we already had a large jump in its best scores this year. It might be more useful as a multimodal reasoning task since it clearly involves visual elements, but with o3 already performing so well, this has proven unnecessary. ARC-AGI served a very specific purpose well: showcasing tasks where humans easily outperfo…

ARC wasn't designed as a benchmark for LLMs, and it doesn't make much sense to compare them on it since it's the wrong modality. Even a MLM with image inputs can't be expected to do well, since they're nothing like 99.999% of the training data. The fact that even a text-only LLM can solve ARC problems with the proper framework is important, however.

Re: OpenAI O3 breakthrough high score on ARC-AGI-PUB

#490

This is insanely expensive to run though. Looks like it cost around $1 million of compute to get that result. Doesn't seem like such a massive breakthrough when they are throwing so much compute at it, particularly as this is test time compute, it just isn't practical at all, you are not getting this level with a ChatGPT subscription, even the new $200 a month option.

Sure but... this is the technology at the most expensive it will ever be. I'm impressed that o3 was able to achieve such high performance at all, and am not too pessimistic about costs decreasing over time.
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