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Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

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Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#11

Post by citricsquid »

ktizo wrote: post #2

The new proposed minimum is about the same size as my flat here in the UK, and I know plenty of people living in smaller places than mine.

The UK has such small apartments, I guess it's down to how small the country is. I think a lot of American people would have a hard time visiting some apartment buildings here and understanding the small sizes. The apartment I live in right now is one of the largest I could find in my current location (Brighton) and I wasn't being cheap (I'm paying $2500/m) and it's only about 450 square feet[1]. I've found that it's quite literally impossible to get an apartment here at 1k square feet unless the cost is >$10k/m, but in America a lot of people consider 1k square feet to be small.

Here's an interesting chart about average sizes in a couple of different countries, the difference between the UK and the US is huge: http://www.apartmenttherapy.com/average-home-sizes-around-th... (this is houses, but most apartments I've visited in the UK are about the same size as the upstairs of a house, so splitting the figure it half seems a good estimate for apartments)

I would theorise that the majority of people living in small apartments are the sort of people that are young and still finding their path in life (career, education) and so don't spend much time in their apartment (most young people that have their own place don't have the luxury of spending 8 hours a day at home, excluding sleep) so they're not that bothered by living in a small space. It's where they sleep and eat and that's about it. If you're a 40 year old that has a career and family living in 200 square feet would seem insane.

[1] http://www.godfreyinv.com/portfolio/17-the-upper-drive/apart...

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#12

Post by po »

I was just talking with a friend yesterday about living in Tokyo. A big part of what makes it reasonable is that everything is smaller. The containers of food I buy at the store are smaller and fit in my smaller refrigerator. There's a laundry place right next door and they give you hangars that are half width (folding the shirts back on themselves like when you buy them) so they can fit in a shallow closet. As an American, it's hard to get used to not buying in bulk but it really helps you make the most of your space.

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#13

Post by marvin »

mdanger wrote: post #3

"That demographic cohort wants to continue their collegiate experience for an indefinite amount of time," Kennedy said. "I envision this as a launching space as they get established." The "collegiate experience" Kennedy seems to be going for with this is dormitory-style living (the article even touts the common areas that will be available to tenants, just like some of the pitches when I was shopping around for colle…

Interesting that someone should say this out loud. I've been thinking this for a long time - I've just been having so much fun as a student, I can't really imagine any other way of living. Cool roommates and always something interesting to do.

When not starting a family or living with a partner, this seems like the best way to live. The alternative would be to live on my own in a nice apartment - this would entail a higher - "standard of living", but be much more expensive and lonely.

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#14

Post by vipervpn »

I'm concerned about house pets (like dogs and cats) in such a small apartment. Are these micro apartments fit for dwelling in for long periods of time? I don't think so. Cats and dogs need space too, and they don't have the freedom to come and go whenever they please.

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#15

Post by axefrog »

vipervpn wrote: post #14

I'm concerned about house pets (like dogs and cats) in such a small apartment. Are these micro apartments fit for dwelling in for long periods of time? I don't think so. Cats and dogs need space too, and they don't have the freedom to come and go whenever they please.

I suspect pet owners are not the target market for this type of living space.

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#16

Post by GFischer »

ktizo wrote: post #2

The new proposed minimum is about the same size as my flat here in the UK, and I know plenty of people living in smaller places than mine.

I used to live in 170 square feet (16 square meters) here in Montevideo, Uruguay, under the proposed SF minimum.

It was enough for a single student/worker like I was at the time - though I did wish for slightly more space, 220 square feet sounds like about right.

Over here, there's a boom of construction of "studios", they sell for 40.000 dollars and rent for about 400/month.

One thing I hope is that they don't cave on the need for natural lighting, I had a view to a wall and it was depressing. But overall I think it's very reasonable of SF to allow these.

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#17

Post by vipervpn »

axefrog wrote: post #15
vipervpn wrote: post #14

I'm concerned about house pets (like dogs and cats) in such a small apartment. Are these micro apartments fit for dwelling in for long periods of time? I don't think so. Cats and dogs need space too, and they don't have the freedom to come and go whenever they please.

I suspect pet owners are not the target market for this type of living space.

Sure, although it's common for single people to have a pet.

I don't know about the US, but in Canada I think it's illegal for renters to discriminate against pet owners. Many still do however.

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#18

Post by GFischer »

vipervpn wrote: post #14

I'm concerned about house pets (like dogs and cats) in such a small apartment. Are these micro apartments fit for dwelling in for long periods of time? I don't think so. Cats and dogs need space too, and they don't have the freedom to come and go whenever they please.

I lived in a smaller apartment than the one described.

Pets were strictly banned, and rightfully so (it would be torture for them).

People do live in those apartments for long periods (in my case, I had some neighbors that were pensioners on small funds that couldn't afford something better, they've been living on those apartments for 15+ years)

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#19

Post by GFischer »

wslh wrote: post #9

Does this sound interesting for investing? it can start a new real state bubble based on micro apartments.

It did start one here in Uruguay, they're popping up like mushrooms, since as long as you can get a renter they pay for themselves in less than 10 years.

Re: Micro-apartments next for S.F.?

#20

Post by alister »

othello wrote: post #6

To put this in a European perspective: the legal minimum floor area to rent out an apartment in France is 9 square meters, or slightly less than 97 sq feet. Even better (or worse, depending on your perspective): the absolute minimum is a volume of 20 cubic meters [1]. Therefore in cities like Paris where flats with high ceilings abound, you find owners of big, old apartments with 3m high ceilings breaking them up in…

> the absolute minimum is a volume of 20 cubic meters

Well, this is fiction, but I'm imagining just how much worse it could get:

In "Futurama" set in the year 3000, Fry and Bender are living together in Bender's closet-sized apartment, and Fry complains that it's too small.

Bender: "Not enough room? My place is 2 cubic meters and we only take up 1.5 cubic meters. We've got room for a whole nother 2/3rds of a person."

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