I had no idea that Rivian had a charging network and they build them like an hour from where I live so I see them all over the place. I just assumed they used the Tesla ones or the generic ones you see all over.
Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
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Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#22TIL Rivian has a charging network
They must not have one, because they’re ALWAYS taking up two stalls at the Tesla supercharger ones.
Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#23I had no idea that Rivian had a charging network and they build them like an hour from where I live so I see them all over the place. I just assumed they used the Tesla ones or the generic ones you see all over.
They do (mis)use the Tesla ones. I don’t expect this announcement means literally anything to any EV brand.
Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#24How did we get from a situation where you could just pay with cash/card for fuel to having monopolized single-brand car fueling stations?
> from a situation where you could just pay with cash/card for fuel to having monopolized single-brand car fueling stations?
The Model T was released in 1908 [1]. Standard Oil was broken up in 1911 [2], 6 years after Bowser added a hose attachment to his pumps [3].
[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Model_T
[2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Oil_Co._of_New_Jers...
Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#25How did we get from a situation where you could just pay with cash/card for fuel to having monopolized single-brand car fueling stations?
When it started taking 30 minutes to "fill up" your car. High speed chargers can cost >$200k installed. A gas pump costs about $25k installed. If the average person spends 4 minutes at a pump, that comes out to: The time value of a slot at a super charger can be >$5 for each charge. The time value of a slot at a gas pump is ~$0.07 per fill up. The economics of a charging business are awful. High CapEx, few cars, not…
>High speed chargers can cost >$200k installed.
>A gas pump costs about $25k installed.
These numbers seem skewed to me. I think you're quoting prices for gas pumps with just the pump, not any storage infrastructure like underground tanks, stores, employees. Then you're quoting the cost high speed chargers without any kind of electrical infrastructure to support them, which would be expensive, but more analogous to including the cost of all the other infrastructure for gas stations as well.
Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#26I had no idea that Rivian had a charging network and they build them like an hour from where I live so I see them all over the place. I just assumed they used the Tesla ones or the generic ones you see all over.
They do (mis)use the Tesla ones. I don’t expect this announcement means literally anything to any EV brand.
in what sense do they misuse them?
Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
When it started taking 30 minutes to "fill up" your car. High speed chargers can cost >$200k installed. A gas pump costs about $25k installed. If the average person spends 4 minutes at a pump, that comes out to: The time value of a slot at a super charger can be >$5 for each charge. The time value of a slot at a gas pump is ~$0.07 per fill up. The economics of a charging business are awful. High CapEx, few cars, not…
>High speed chargers can cost >$200k installed. >A gas pump costs about $25k installed. These numbers seem skewed to me. I think you're quoting prices for gas pumps with just the pump, not any storage infrastructure like underground tanks, stores, employees. Then you're quoting the cost high speed chargers without any kind of electrical infrastructure to support them, which would be expensive, but more analogous to i…
Storage tanks are (relatively) cheap. Stores and employees are needed because margins on gasoline are extremely thin, and it's an easy way to make money if you're already putting in the pumps.
The infrastructure for high speed chargers is a lot of metal, which unlike a store, does not contribute extra money in addition to the pump.
Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
They do (mis)use the Tesla ones. I don’t expect this announcement means literally anything to any EV brand.
in what sense do they misuse them?
They take up 2 spots: https://www.reddit.com/r/Rivian/comments/1f0wt4v/okay_is_the...
Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#29Rivian's charging network map: https://rivian.com/experience/charging#map
They have plans to install 3,500 stations across North America, but they have a ways to go to reach that level of density.
Re: Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs
#30How did we get from a situation where you could just pay with cash/card for fuel to having monopolized single-brand car fueling stations?
When it started taking 30 minutes to "fill up" your car. High speed chargers can cost >$200k installed. A gas pump costs about $25k installed. If the average person spends 4 minutes at a pump, that comes out to: The time value of a slot at a super charger can be >$5 for each charge. The time value of a slot at a gas pump is ~$0.07 per fill up. The economics of a charging business are awful. High CapEx, few cars, not…
I would think that given the chargers are so expensive, they'd want to make them easy to pay to use.
I have a PHEV, so using a charger out and about is silly, but I've only managed to use one pay charger, and it was a lot harder than a gas pump. Even the free ones are hard to use. With the PHEV, the charged amounts are rather low, so I understand the desire to push stored value accounts, but really there should have been colaboration and portability, and at least chargers should have clear information on how to make them start. Go to some website and here's my name on the website. I've seen some that do, but many that don't.
Gas pumps aren't always easy either. I've had several cars where you have to hold it right or the pump stops, but I've never had much trouble giving them money. Also had fun when VW sent out anti-misfueling inserts for my TDI and I got to learn which diesel pumps had unleaded gasoline sized nozzles and which had leaded gasoline sized nozzles; before the insert, the car would take either, after only the leaded fuel size.