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Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

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Re: Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

#81

Post by codinghorror »

callahad wrote: post #74
_urga wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"we're really, really easy to implement" "I want to see us become the de facto auth solution" "We also let you reach many, many more people" "but we're also a really nice option to put alongside your social login" Assuming by "we" and "us" you mean Mozilla? Or do you also mean the other major browsers? Why did you write it like that? Why not just say "Persona" instead of "we" and "us"? Surely Persona is much bigger t…

I work for Mozilla on the Persona team, so it feels natural to say "we" to refer to us and the specific implementation we've built, but I see your point as to the feel of that language. Thanks for calling me out. Persona certainly has a scope beyond Mozilla, and its current state owes much to open collaboration.

I'm not a fan of the way this requires me to set a password for Persona. I'd rather just have one password, my email (gmail) password, and use that.

Re: Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

#82

Post by Nic56 »

callahad wrote: post #73
carlesfe wrote: post #69

Okay, I have read the specs, the FAQ, the diagrams, and tried some examples, but I can't really understand how it works. Could somebody do a quick summary for me? I would appreciate it very much.

I really, really need to post something like this on our blog soon. Watch http://identity.mozilla.com/ for something more polished next week or so. I'd also strongly urge you to just try implementing it on a site. It'll literally take less than 30 lines each of javascript on the frontend and python on the backend, and it'll really demystify the flow between the site and the user. As an analogy, we work really similar…

So in your example, eyedee.me is your email provider, right?

I made a Persona account just now. All I saw happening was that I clicked on a link in a confirmation email. Was there also communication between mozilla and my email provider? (I am with a small ISP who is serving my emails - I have my own domain, so my email address is sthg like me@myname.com). What went on behind the curtains, if anything, and why did it work with my small provider right away?

Re: Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

#83

Post by [deleted] »

_urga wrote: post #72
callahad wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the biggest wins for sites is that we reduce account creation / sign in friction for your users, so you get an awesome, easy flow through your funnel without having to give up ownership of your user data. We also let you reach many, many more people, since you're not forcing users into joining an anointed social network. Everyone has an email address, and people understand what it means to reveal it. Also, the…

"we're really, really easy to implement" "I want to see us become the de facto auth solution" "We also let you reach many, many more people" "but we're also a really nice option to put alongside your social login" Assuming by "we" and "us" you mean Mozilla? Or do you also mean the other major browsers? Why did you write it like that? Why not just say "Persona" instead of "we" and "us"? Surely Persona is much bigger t…

[deleted]

Re: Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

#85

Post by zerostar07 »

nostromo wrote: post #35

One of the reasons FB and Twitter OAuth became so popular is because they solved a problem for the user (remembering passwords) and also gave the site owner a big carrot (social growth mechanics, more user data). This seems much more one sided -- it's good for the user that doesn't use FB or Twitter but 'meh' for the website. I'm not sure we'll see fast adoption like we have for OAuth.

Many websites just want an identifier, without having to torture the user by asking them to give a password. Facebook and twitter are not a good option for that. I don't want to know my users' facebook details and certainly don't want them to think i'm one of those crappy apps that post on their wall. Twitter is down more often than not as i 've noticed, and again, i dont want users to be uncomfortable about sharing their identity with my website.

Plus, twitter and facebook won't be here forever and may be a fad. Imagine if people used their myspace handle to login to their bank account today. And facebook accounts get disabled/hacked much more often than, say, gmail. E-mail is much more signup-and-forget and nobody considers giving their email address a privacy violation.

I see lots of complaints here about the technical aspects of browserid, yet i believe it's the most pragmatic approach one can take to rid the web from the dreaded password plague.

Re: Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

#86

Post by drcongo »

StavrosK wrote: post #78
callahad wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the biggest wins for sites is that we reduce account creation / sign in friction for your users, so you get an awesome, easy flow through your funnel without having to give up ownership of your user data. We also let you reach many, many more people, since you're not forcing users into joining an anointed social network. Everyone has an email address, and people understand what it means to reveal it. Also, the…

I've been using BrowserID/Persona on my sites and I love it. For an example, go to http://www.yourpane.com and click "BrowserID" (never mind the other fields). It always takes me 5 minutes to integrate, doesn't require me to write any sort of "forgot password" functionality, doesn't require me to worry about storing passwords, and it's generally very easy to work with. One problem is that users don't know if they're…

That provided a pretty confusing journey. First attempt: I clicked the Browser ID button, entered my email address on Persona, got redirected back to your site with no messaging. Tried again, it asked me to give a password this time. Did so, but then didn't redirect me back to your site. I then had to manually go back to your site and hit the BrowserID button for a 3rd time, which then took me to a Persona page to log into your site.

Re: Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

#87

Post by Flimm »

codinghorror wrote: post #81
callahad wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work for Mozilla on the Persona team, so it feels natural to say "we" to refer to us and the specific implementation we've built, but I see your point as to the feel of that language. Thanks for calling me out. Persona certainly has a scope beyond Mozilla, and its current state owes much to open collaboration.

I'm not a fan of the way this requires me to set a password for Persona. I'd rather just have one password, my email (gmail) password, and use that.

That's the plan. Mozilla are just waiting on Gmail to cooperate and implement Persona on their side.

In an ideal situation, both your browser (eg: Firefox) and your email provider (eg: Gmail) would support Persona. In that case, you don't have to click on any links to prove your email address, you don't have to create a new password, you don't have to trust Mozilla's servers to store a hashed version of your password correctly. The log-in dialog itself with be part of the browser chrome, training users to trust the browser and not the website, which is a good thing.

If your browser or your email provider don't support Persona, then Mozilla have provided fallbacks, which require you to click a link in an email and to create a new Persona-specific password.

Re: Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

#88

Post by StavrosK »

drcongo wrote: post #86
StavrosK wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been using BrowserID/Persona on my sites and I love it. For an example, go to http://www.yourpane.com and click "BrowserID" (never mind the other fields). It always takes me 5 minutes to integrate, doesn't require me to write any sort of "forgot password" functionality, doesn't require me to worry about storing passwords, and it's generally very easy to work with. One problem is that users don't know if they're…

That provided a pretty confusing journey. First attempt: I clicked the Browser ID button, entered my email address on Persona, got redirected back to your site with no messaging. Tried again, it asked me to give a password this time. Did so, but then didn't redirect me back to your site. I then had to manually go back to your site and hit the BrowserID button for a 3rd time, which then took me to a Persona page to lo…

That's odd... The first time, you probably needed to verify your email, and I'm using the old API, so it doesn't sign you in right away. The second time, I don't know why it didn't log you in, I'll have to look into it...

Re: Introducing Mozilla Persona, An Identity System for the Web

#90

Post by znq »

znq wrote: post #89

What about native mobile apps? Is it possible to easily use Browser ID for native iOS and Android apps? Or is it just too much of a hassle getting the information out of the web view?

I just found this https://github.com/mozilla/browserid-ios however haven't tried it out, yet.
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