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QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

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Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#331
post #329

32B is a good choice of size, as it allows running on a 24GB consumer card at ~4 bpw (RTX 3090/4090) while using most of the VRAM. Unlike llama 3.1, which had 8b, 70B (much too big to fit), and 405B.

what do you mean? I can easily run 70b on my macbook. Fits easily.

> what do you mean? I can easily run 70b on my macbook. Fits easily

Does your MacBook really have a 24GB VRAM consumer (GPU) card?

Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#332

We are lucky that Alibaba, Meta and Mistral sees some strategic value in public releases. If we it was just one of them, it would be a fragile situation for downstream startups. And they’re even situated in three different countries.

> We are lucky that Alibaba, Meta and Mistral sees some strategic value in public releases.

Now if we only can get Meta to understand what "Open Source" means so the word doesn't lose all meaning in the future.

Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your job or hobby in any way likes LLMs, and you like to "Work Anywhere", it's hard not to justify the MBP Max (e.g. M3 Max, now M4 Max) with 128GB. You can run more than you'd think, faster than you'd think. See also Hugging Face's MLX community: https://huggingface.co/mlx-community QwQ 32B is featured: https://huggingface.co/collections/mlx-community/qwq-32b-pre... If you want a traditional GUI, LM Studio beta 0…

4699$US. Quickest justification I ever made not to buy something

To add to that, given the wild trajectory of the field, it's at the very least doubtful, that that's going to buy you access to hardware (let alone: a model) that's still even remotely desirable for relevant AI use, even a year from now.

Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#334
post #331
post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what do you mean? I can easily run 70b on my macbook. Fits easily.

> what do you mean? I can easily run 70b on my macbook. Fits easily Does your MacBook really have a 24GB VRAM consumer (GPU) card?

Newer mac books have a unified memory architecture, so the GPU can use all the available memory if it wants.

Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#335
post #291

I am right now playing with it running it locally using ollama. It is a 19GB download and it runs nicely on a nvidia A100 GPU. https://ollama.com/library/qwq

Runs nicely on my AMD 7900XTX too.

Care to say how many tokens per second you're getting?

Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#336
post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what do you mean? I can easily run 70b on my macbook. Fits easily.

Macs that can run it are quite a bit more expensive than a 3090. GPUs can also do finetuning and run other models with larger batch sizes which Macs would struggle with. Also, for the models that fit both, an nvidia card can run it much faster.

It’s really not that expensive to get an M4 pro with 64GB. But you really want a Max or ultra, and you aren’t going to be able to do much with images. You are limited on the GPU part.

3090s aren’t sold anymore, so you have to scrounge for them in the used market, 4090s are a couple K? The local LLM scene is still pricey and confusing.

Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven’t been super impressed with it, and haven’t encountered any practical tasks I wanted to solve with an LLM where o1 worked any better than prompting 4o or Sonnet to use more extensive CoT. There might be some narrow band of practical problems in between what other LLMs can do and what o1 can’t, but I don’t think that really matters for most use cases, especially given how much slower it is. Day to day, you jus…

I think the true edge of CoT models will come from layman usability. While I can easily prompt Claude for examples and then manually modify the code to fill in the gaps, general domain knowledge and technical understanding is absolutely required from the human sitting in front of the screen. With o1, a layman can sit in front of the computer, and ask 'I want a website for tracking deliveries for my webshop and make i…

>With o1, a layman can sit in front of the computer, and ask 'I want a website for tracking deliveries for my webshop and make it pretty', and the model will do it.

I just punched that prompt into Sonnet 3.5 and o1 and I wouldn't say that o1 is doing anything better than Sonnet. o1 certainly didn't "do it", it gave me a very broad outline of how to accomplish that, from "Define requirements" to "Test and deply on Vercel"

Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#339

So western controls on training hardware (hello NVIDIA) seem to have failed. I wonder if there will be any repercussions here.

Most of the papers in machine learning are coming from China. The vast majority. Most of the open source models on GitHub, too. Hailuo, Kling, Vidu, and Hunyuan (posted on Banodoko) blow Sora and Runway out of the water. China is dominating at this field. And if they begin releasing weights as open source, that'll mean foundation model companies can only bank on the thin facade of product. That's a really good strate…

I don't know why you're getting downvoted.

Anyone actually reading papers in this area knows there's a lot of interesting work coming out of Chinese universities.

For many years, American immigration policy has meant a PhD is particularly beneficial to immigrants, with predictable effects on who earns PhDs [1]. It's no surprise that, when industry needs advanced degrees and people who can read and write papers, we find author lists full of one-syllable surnames.

[1] https://cra.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/2023-CRA-Taulbee-...

Re: QwQ: Alibaba's O1-like reasoning LLM

#340
post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what do you mean? I can easily run 70b on my macbook. Fits easily.

Macs that can run it are quite a bit more expensive than a 3090. GPUs can also do finetuning and run other models with larger batch sizes which Macs would struggle with. Also, for the models that fit both, an nvidia card can run it much faster.

I see often MBP with 48-64gb and 1TB under than 3500 CHF. Including the M4 (thx to black Friday week).

Meanwhile 4090 are close to 2000CHF.

I have no doubt where the actual value is.

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