Live data from Hacker News

In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

lithub.com

261–270 of 351 posts

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#261
post #2

The irony of praising print and rhetoricizing reading on a website that is nearly unreadable due to intrusive visual ads is kind of a sign that collapse is an era behind us.

Oh gosh you are right. I turned off the adblocker to check it out. I often kind of forget the adblock-less world is out there.

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#262

The message is fair and valid, and seemingly true, but cripes, that's some thick reading unless you are literally a scholar. Dial it back. Talk about never use 5 words when an opaque and obscure reference will do.

Also it's kind of hard to find definite statements to agree or disagree with. I mean it's all like "the arc of the moral universe had turned in part because of the supposedly liberatory power of technology". What does that actually mean? What is the arc of the moral universe? Which way did it turn? I wasn't aware it actually had an arc.

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#263
post #195

The experience of passive consumption (cable TV, tiktok, etc, pointed out in another comment here) is essentially the experience of psychological obliteration. When you get sucked into reels, you go from "here" to "there," and in the process, while you are "there," your entire whole self is destroyed. The same psychological phenomena happens to gambling addicts, alcoholics, or users of heroin. It has fewer physiologi…

I'm mildly affected by "modern web" issues, and I reckon that the imaginative part of my brain is in a coma whenever I browse these sites. The minute I'm outside of an internet connection, a whole lot of emotions, ideas, plans come back at once. And very very rarely can I browse the web while not losing that. This is something I didn't experience before... say smartphones, even with a good dsl line, i wasn't dilluted in pages likes that.

ps: now that I think about it, it started around the ajax era.. as soon as a webpage could change parts in the blink of an eye your perception of the web is altered IMO.

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the ultra wealthy have different priorities to what I would call important. The yachts, deregulation, tacit (or not) support for torture, illegal wars, pollution, private jets, ostentatious displays of conspicuous and pointless wealth, etc, leave that in no doubt. Were you trying to say that maybe all that destruction in the pursuit of insatiable greed could be 'good' somehow? Like Zorg's little speech [0] about…

> It's astounding how people can have all the facts and teachers in the world, while dodging genuine understanding of everything most important. You said they are dodging 'genuine understanding'. I am saying you aren't the final word on what 'genuine understanding of everything most important' is. In other words - you are using lots of words to say 'I want others to do more of the stuff I want them to do and less of…

So anyone who uses the phrase "genuine understanding" is secretly a wannabe power-hungry authoritarian? Dunno about that one bud.

And anyone who calls out vapid conspicuous consumption, or the greedy exploitation of the planet for personal gain, that's not obviously perverse to you; it's just one person's opinion and easily disregarded - because they're not the final word on genuine understanding?

Well, pick your prophet; pick your genius; they all say the same thing:

"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God."

- Jesus.

"By his craving for riches the foolish man slays himself, as if he were slaying others."

- Buddha

"The mutual rivalry for piling up of worldly things diverts you, until you visit the graves."

- The Qur'an

"He who is not contented with what he has, would not be contented with what he would like to have."

- Socrates

"It is not the man who has too little, but the man who craves more, that is poor."

- Seneca

"The more you have, the more you want. The more you have, the less you are."

- Tolstoy

"A calm and modest life brings more happiness than the pursuit of success combined with constant restlessness."

- Einstein

"Wealth is like seawater: the more you drink, the thirstier you become."

- Schopenhauer

"A small terrace by the mountain stream, living at ease, free from the burdens of the world — this is better than the glory of an emperor."

- Zhuangzi

Etc, etc, etc.

Some people, really, truly, have a genuine understanding of this concept. And many, probably most incredibly wealthy people, with every possible opportunity, can't grasp it for the life of them. That's not really "my opinion"; it's the opinion of anyone worth listening to.

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#265
I'm skeptical there is any epistemological collapse. Checking Wikipedia because I'm rusty on that stuff, it has epistemology as "the branch of philosophy that examines the nature, origin, and limits of knowledge." As someone old enough to have been reading paper books pre internet I don't think that's collapsed at all. The very fact that I can look it up on Wikipedia and reference Reddit is a step forward.

The article reminds me of Calvin and Hobbes 'Academia here I come' (Reddit reference: https://www.reddit.com/r/calvinandhobbes/comments/1300k80/ac...)

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why presume that? "Gauze" makes sense.

I read the sentence a couple of times to try to figure out what the phrase “ephemeral gauze” was intended to convey but failed to make sense of it. So, I figured that “gaze” may have been the intended word, i.e., readers pay particular attention to text while they’re in the process of reading it (gaze) but that it’s quickly forgotten when they move on to the next unrelated thing they see on the Internet (ephemerality…

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gauzy definition 3

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading a book is not really passive. Especially if it's a good book. You have to constantly imagine the layouts and the connections the book is trying to draw. For me, after years of Internet, getting back to books made me appreciate my younger self because books need active imagination and follow-through in the brain. I was able to do that effortlessly when I was a child. In fact, if you read all the HN comments th…

I don't use imagination when I read. The connections are instinctual, and the layouts are often irrelevant (which I can say because I've never attempted to consider them and don't ever find myself missing out on the story). I'd like to say I'm astounded when I hear other people visit other worlds when they read, but really that whole idea is so foreign to me, it might as well be a complete lie. I have no thread in wh…

So when a scene is described, what happens in your head? You take it all in as a sort of dry list of facts? If someone gets punched in the face that conjures an image of a fist connecting with a face for me.

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#269
post #195

The experience of passive consumption (cable TV, tiktok, etc, pointed out in another comment here) is essentially the experience of psychological obliteration. When you get sucked into reels, you go from "here" to "there," and in the process, while you are "there," your entire whole self is destroyed. The same psychological phenomena happens to gambling addicts, alcoholics, or users of heroin. It has fewer physiologi…

Is reading not also a “there” thing?

Re: In Praise of Print: Reading Is Essential in an Era of Epistemological Collapse

#270

My 2 cents: 1- 'The Department of Education’s most recent survey, released in June, was sensational: it found that text comprehension skills of 13-year-olds had declined an average of four points since the Covid-affected school year of 2019-2020, and more alarmingly that the average drop was seven points compared with the 2012 figure. The results for the worst-performing students fell below the reading skill level re…

The COVID school closures and remote learning years will prove to be the biggest negative educational/developmental impact on a generation that we've seen in a long time.

I mean it looks like it might have sped it up but it already declined more than that from 2012. So whatever the general reason for the trend is worse.
Post reply on HN