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The size of BYD's factory

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Re: The size of BYD's factory

#541

Post by xbmcuser »

alsodumb wrote: post #490
adventured wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have had that reputation for a long time and it persists. Assuming companies like BYD do things correctly, they'll come from the bottom up and improve quality as they go while working to keep their volume position. Pretty much all the major automakers should be terrified, as China is likely to have two or three juggernaut auto companies, they'll be permanently cash loaded by their gigantic domestic market, and t…

Other countries, maybe. But China is never gonna conquer or do reasonable business in India for geopolitical reasons.

Not really US is trying to prop India as a counter to China but India is just using US it has no interests in having a bad relationship with China no matter how much the west would like to do that India is not interested. India is just going to use China as bogeyman for the west to get concessions and help from the west but in the end they will do what is best for them and that is not fighting China.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#542

Post by Symbiote »

zppln wrote: post #525
gamblor956 wrote: post #509

LA purchased a few BYD e-Buses a few years ago and BYD is still trying to make a bus with a lifespan longer than about 1 month. While L.A. is trying to make the purchase work, most of their other U.S. transportation agency clients have simply demanded refunds. BYD succeeds in places where quality and safety doesn't matter. It's why they've taken off in Asia but have made minimal inroads in countries with strong autom…

My city in Sweden use BYD buses (I think they're pretty much the only option?). My impression is that they've worked pretty well, with more cities buying into them.

Copenhagen has Man, Mercedes and Yutong electric buses, I think.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#543

Post by ASalazarMX »

inemesitaffia wrote: post #312
postmeta wrote: post #239

BYD 900k employees vs Tesla 122k https://cnevpost.com/2024/09/13/byd-workforce-exceeds-900000...

They make batteries, regular cars and hybrids and the cost of labor is lower

American EV manufacturers should realize that designing aspirational products erodes their growth, even if it means short-term profits. BYD is building practical EVs at affordable prices, not fashion articles.

If their offer wasn't a good deal, they wouldn't be growing so aggressively in Latin America. They're filling a niche western EVs have ignored for almost a decade.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#545

Post by JackFr »

sangnoir wrote: post #507
JackFr wrote: post #480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those old enough to remember, we heard it all before in the 1980's about Japan so experience has made us circumspect. But even more so, markets enforce discipline on capital that state directed firms don't have. Everyone decries executives who "only look as far as next quarter's profits", and while admittedly at the margins that can have perverse incentives, in the large it demands that management put capital to…

Japan was different in that it never became the world's factory, and then, manufacturing skills hadn't atrophied in the west, so it's a little different now. Even so, past performance is no guarantee for future results. > But even more so, markets enforce discipline on capital that state directed firms don't have I struggle to reconcile this with stock buy-backs. Also, China seems to have deployed a hybrid strategy:…

> I struggle to reconcile this with stock buy-backs.

Would it offend your sensibilities less if they paid dividends with that money?

Buybacks are simply a more tax advantageous means of returning profits to share holders.

Similarly debt financed buybacks are a morally neutral way to change the capital structure of the firm by replacing equity with debt.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#546

Post by fspeech »

petesergeant wrote: post #529
coliveira wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole "demographics" scare about China is clear nonsense. Even if that becomes true, it will take 25 to 30 years for it to manifest, because China consumption is in a growing curve. The current young working population is more educated and productive than ever. And China still has hundreds of millions of people to be included into its consumer and labor market in the poorest areas. So don't hold your breath about…

> The whole "demographics" scare about China is clear nonsense I mean it's probably fair to call it the consensus opinion, so a claim as extraordinary as calling it "clear nonsense" probably requires extraordinary proof?

One needs to disaggregate data to get a full picture of what happens in China due to the rapid evolution of things. Forty years ago very few people went to college. It's a big bulge of population that are not going to upgrade their skills (mostly retired but things like learning to drive or using the popular apps are still difficult for most who have not already learned). They are also very used to hardship and will consume little even if they come into unexpected wealth (say from housing). The demographic shift will not play out as everywhere else.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#547

Post by xbmcuser »

coliveira wrote: post #511
petesergeant wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China's leadership is probably terrified of falling into the middle-income trap I feel like it's more of a case of how do they get out of it, rather than avoid falling into it, at this point. The demographics are shit and the country isn't particularly attractive to immigrants, nor (unlike, America and Canada, and honestly most of Europe, despite what the right wing say) do they really have room for more immigrants…

The whole "demographics" scare about China is clear nonsense. Even if that becomes true, it will take 25 to 30 years for it to manifest, because China consumption is in a growing curve. The current young working population is more educated and productive than ever. And China still has hundreds of millions of people to be included into its consumer and labor market in the poorest areas. So don't hold your breath about…

I agree I think the ai boom has happened at the optimal time for China by the time they hit the problem of higher older population. Automation would solve a lot of their problems. As someone that is not from china or the west I feel it is ironic that how much western citizens talk about Chinese state propaganda but at the same they fall for their own governments propaganda.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#548

Post by munificent »

munificent wrote: post #499
Dalewyn wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The incentive to raise prices is pressured down by customers' desire to not spend more money than they have to. If businesses can get away with raising prices that means the price was too low to begin with, tariffs or no tariffs.

That's dependent on the market actually being efficient. If a consumer walks into a store and sees coffeemakers by ten different brands, but seven are all actually owned by one giant manufacturer and the other three by some American almost-as-giant manufacturer, then a tariff on the former will drive up the price of seven of them and the American manufacturer will almost certainly raise the prices on the remaining th…

Oops, in "actually owned by one giant manufacturer", I meant to say "actually owned by one giant Chinese manufacturer".

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#550

Post by qwezxcrty »

jpgvm wrote: post #362
looofooo0 wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No freight train connection to the factory??

There is. In fact it's called a "land port" for a reason, the park has a huge freight yard connected to 2 rail lines it's just not shown in this picture because it's shared infrastructure of the industrial park.

I don't think there is any railway link to the site, at least in the short term. Both of the two rail lines nearby are passanger only high speed (250 km/h to 350 km/h) lines (references: https://zh.wikipedia.org/zh-cn/%E9%83%91%E9%98%9C%E9%AB%98%E... , https://zh.wikipedia.org/zh-cn/%E9%83%91%E6%B8%9D%E9%AB%98%E... ). The train yard ~5 km north of the factory is 郑州南动车所, also a high speed rail depot.

That area is called 郑州港区 (literal translation Zhengzhou "port area", full name: 郑州航空港经济综合实验区) is actually for it's closeness to the airport (ZHCC). English reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhengzhou_Airport_Economy_Zone .

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