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The size of BYD's factory

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Re: The size of BYD's factory

#521
post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here in Brazil. Even in the countryside.

I'm curious: Do Chinese cars have the stigma of being crap quality in other countries? Here in Mexico most anecdotes of people buying Chinese cars are that after less than a year something broke and they had to take it to the repair shop, where it stayed for a very long time due to a lack of pieces even by the manufacturer.

There are a lot of them here in NZ. Definitely no reputation for being 'crap'. By all accounts they are quality vehicles. The local car share business has a large fleet.

I'm pretty confident that once the Seagull lands we will see a lot more. I expect it to be the modern equivalent of the late 90s - early 00s Hyundai Excel. That was an entry level car that blew everything else out of the water in Australia due to low prices coupled with a crazy long and generous warranty. It really set Hyundai up in a market as a legitimate mainstream brand.

What I find especially interesting is that at the same time the North American brands have hitched their wagon to the 'bloated vehicle' trend here. They seem to be relying almost entirely on SUVs, and 'trucks'. Recently they are pushing models like the F150 and Ram on the back of their success with big utes like the Ford Ranger. Personally I think this is just going to make them vulnerable to the incoming wave of more sensible Chinese options.

Edit:

It just occurred to me that the idea of car share business using popular North American vehicles seems kind of absurd. Who would want a fleet of oversized SUVs and trucks? I think this says something about the true utility of these vehicles.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#522

I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but the amount of BYD's I see on the streets of Bangkoks today compared to say two years ago must be an 1000% increase. They are absolutely everywhere.

Largest EV manufacturer in the world, of course you would see them everywhere.

My point was more in how fast it has gone from 0 to every other car I see in a very short time.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#523

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a systemic issue with the Western way of thinking. The West always consider itself to be the most evolved culture in history. First, by way of Christianity, later, by way of markets, democracy, and science. This way of thinking is self-deceiving because they cannot understand that other cultures can offer something equal or better. So, when faced with the advance of other cultures they necessarily have to dis…

This isn't really unique to any particular culture. China spent a good couple millenia referring to anyone outside its borders as 'barbarians.'

Well, they clearly don't have that issue anymore. Maybe that's why they're now where they are.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#524
post #25

All this to produce machines of 2T to displace 80kg of human on average (think about it, the battery weight more than what it actually need to move on average) and maintain/develop car dependency infrastructures. This is the worst way of improving our efficiency and progress toward a more optimized, efficient economy and reducing massively our climate and biodiversity impact. I want those kind of factories to produce…

Why can’t both be done? Bicycles are already cheap, and an electric bike can be purchased under $1000. Not everyone is capable of limiting their commute to the ~10 mile radius an e-bike easily permits. Some of us still need cars, unfortunately. Sometimes the weather is bad, or we have things to haul around, or multiple people to move. Is there some technology that enables high-speed travel and weighs less than a huma…

Not sure about the weights-less-than-human part, but definitely bikes in trains

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#525

LA purchased a few BYD e-Buses a few years ago and BYD is still trying to make a bus with a lifespan longer than about 1 month. While L.A. is trying to make the purchase work, most of their other U.S. transportation agency clients have simply demanded refunds. BYD succeeds in places where quality and safety doesn't matter. It's why they've taken off in Asia but have made minimal inroads in countries with strong autom…

My city in Sweden use BYD buses (I think they're pretty much the only option?). My impression is that they've worked pretty well, with more cities buying into them.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone from Australia, which hasn't shut its self off from the China EV market. I drive a BYD Dolphin. You should be worried. They are cheaper, and more full-featured than European equivalent. They aren't junk. Also, they aren't the only big player from China. Australia is soon getting GAC/Aion, Geely, Jaecoo, Leapmotor, Deepal, Xpeng. Here is an article if interested. https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-news/which-…

Does Australia ask manufacturers to setup factories locally? I always think it's a good idea for employment and perhaps technology transfer. I don't know why Canada is not doing that. Getting a couple of big car factories could be huge for the locals. That's thousands and thousands of employment.

Australia had a domestic car manufacturing by Ford and GM - popular V8 rear wheel drive sedans on their own platforms but the govt decide to stop protecting the industry and Ford and GM was also not willing to invest money in manufacturing is such a low volume market and little export potential.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US government bailed out GM under Obama. Do you know what GM did this month? They spent billions on stock buybacks and millions on bonuses while firing a ton of people. F'em. They aren't a car company, they are a stock company that happens to make cars, a route most large American companies seem to be taking (see also Boeing, whose management cares so much about/is detached from their product that they relocated…

China is a 30 million a year car market and up until 2 years ago,GM used to sell more cars in China than in the US . It was an incredible cash cow .

GM sales has cratered there - a wrong product mix for a market that wants 36% EV's or hybrids hence them focusing on new EV platform and doing the new Bolt.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#528

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's a type of Western mind that gets distracted by their scale, and getting to build things we built a century ago Where in the US can one find the secret, cross-country high-speed rail built in the roaring twenties?! There's also a type of western mind that automatically dismisses the odds of a different country succeeding, based on nothing but the fact that they are using a different approach (on the surface)…

Asking why we don't have a high speed cross country railroad in a nation that had most of its airports build out 60 years ago is an excellent pattern match for odd complaints.* Thinking whether you're a Sinophile is a subject of discussion, and then most damningly, your closing thought being whether other people think "the west will prevail" shows there's a lot more going on here than the idea that maybe overcapacity…

If you're going to disagree, can you do us all a favor by not misrepresenting my words?

> Asking why we don't have a high speed cross country railroad

I asked where the high speed rail is, because parent claimed China is building out infrastructure "we built a 100 years ago" - which is patently untrue. I even quoted parent, so you can't have missed that.

> damningly, your closing thought being whether other people think "the west will prevail"

Bravo! That's a tabloid-worthy recontextualization hit-job - you cut off the part I considered so important I originally added emphasis to it, and added your commentary to give my surviving words an unflattering meaning of your choosing that was never there. I said "...an almost religious belief that the west will prevail because it's the west"

A good day to you.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China's leadership is probably terrified of falling into the middle-income trap I feel like it's more of a case of how do they get out of it, rather than avoid falling into it, at this point. The demographics are shit and the country isn't particularly attractive to immigrants, nor (unlike, America and Canada, and honestly most of Europe, despite what the right wing say) do they really have room for more immigrants…

The whole "demographics" scare about China is clear nonsense. Even if that becomes true, it will take 25 to 30 years for it to manifest, because China consumption is in a growing curve. The current young working population is more educated and productive than ever. And China still has hundreds of millions of people to be included into its consumer and labor market in the poorest areas. So don't hold your breath about…

> The whole "demographics" scare about China is clear nonsense

I mean it's probably fair to call it the consensus opinion, so a claim as extraordinary as calling it "clear nonsense" probably requires extraordinary proof?

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#530

LA purchased a few BYD e-Buses a few years ago and BYD is still trying to make a bus with a lifespan longer than about 1 month. While L.A. is trying to make the purchase work, most of their other U.S. transportation agency clients have simply demanded refunds. BYD succeeds in places where quality and safety doesn't matter. It's why they've taken off in Asia but have made minimal inroads in countries with strong autom…

Albuquerque had a contract with BYD for buses. The first one arrived late and had tons of problems - the range was 1/3 less than contracted, there were broken welds, leaking axles, malfunctioning doors and wheelchair lifts, and brake problems. The second bus wasn't much better. They eventually canceled the contract and bought diesel buses from New Flyer, which was a step backwards, as most (if not all) of our other buses run on natural gas.

The most frustrating part was that these were for a new dedicated bus lane which required the passenger door on the opposite side of the bus, so the city couldn't just use buses they already had in the meanwhile. Instead the lane went unused for nearly two years after it was built, in which we lost a lane of car traffic but were still having to share the remaining lanes with buses.

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