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The size of BYD's factory

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Re: The size of BYD's factory

#161

Post by hackernewds »

mrtksn wrote: post #149
brcmthrowaway wrote: post #83

Can the west compete?

The problem with the west is that it’s already developed. Everything in the west is a bit like the European automobile industry, it’s highly refined for what it is and we expect to milk it for some time to come. Same thing happened with the financial institutions and internet infrastructure - those who had the early versions of it established early ended up lagging behind once the technology was superseded. The poore…

strongly disagree. the West has almost no manufacturing capability or labor force (at an affordable rate) at the moment. it's almost unsustainable even for a small business to be paying $20 an hour in some cities let alone run large factories

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#162

Post by 8note »

pornel wrote: post #133
edhelas wrote: post #25

All this to produce machines of 2T to displace 80kg of human on average (think about it, the battery weight more than what it actually need to move on average) and maintain/develop car dependency infrastructures. This is the worst way of improving our efficiency and progress toward a more optimized, efficient economy and reducing massively our climate and biodiversity impact. I want those kind of factories to produce…

World's response to the climate crisis is already dangerously delayed, and we're at a point where we need anything ASAP. We've ran out of time to massively overhaul infrastructure everywhere. The US and UK apparently can't even build a single high speed rail line any more. Car dependency sucks, but we won't be able to fix that in the short term, but at least we can fix its oil dependence. Cleaner grid will also need…

I don't think it's a particularly different timescale to swap from ICE to EV than to drastically reduce car dependence. What makes you think there's a big difference to where swapping to electric cars is easier than avoiding cars?

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#163

Post by timomaxgalvin »

p2detar wrote: post #112
edhelas wrote: post #25

All this to produce machines of 2T to displace 80kg of human on average (think about it, the battery weight more than what it actually need to move on average) and maintain/develop car dependency infrastructures. This is the worst way of improving our efficiency and progress toward a more optimized, efficient economy and reducing massively our climate and biodiversity impact. I want those kind of factories to produce…

There is a clear reason why such factories are being built in China and if you are a USA or German citizen, you wouldn't like it. In a BBC article from a couple of days ago [0], they hinted that China intends to take the lead into transitioning developing countries from fossil fuels to green tech. They produce batteries, EVs and solar panels. Just this year alone Pakistan of all the countries, imported 13 gigawatts (…

Pakistan has better geography for solar.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#164

Post by hackernewds »

bdangubic wrote: post #98
brcmthrowaway wrote: post #83

Can the west compete?

west can compete. unlike byd’s, which get bricked all the time without infrastructure to maintain and repair them, west (and japan even more so) build cars that last. this is china we are talking about, the last thing I want is a car made by them… :)

your iPhone is manufactured in China :). your view is very outdated, or maybe even willfully. I'm sure they're plenty capable

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#165

Post by 8note »

robocat wrote: post #76
wbl wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that expensive to put down a bike lane.

It is outrageously expensive. "Building 101km of cycleways across Christchurch to cost $301m", population 405000, So that is $750 per person, which is about 1% of median earnings for a year. That is paid for mostly by car owners (via petrol tax and car tax) and a bit by home owners. And the new infrastructure is visibly under-utilised - at best a few % of traffic. You could force people to bike using laws and economi…

Bike lane construction tends to be lumped in with regular road maintenance, which makes it look expensive, but the really expensive part is doing repairs on the existing roads. "Building bike lanes" for 300M is more palatable than "fixing potholes and repainting" for 300M

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#166

Post by hnthrowaway0328 »

greenthrow wrote: post #144
hnthrowaway0328 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When Trump ups everything from China by 100% I guess US would be able to make something with profit?

That is not remotely how tariffs work.

Doesn't a tariff drive up prices? (or at least intended for that)

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#167

Post by richardw »

p2detar wrote: post #109
brcmthrowaway wrote: post #83

Can the west compete?

Define "the west". There was an interesting article here in HN the other day [0] "Almost 10% of South Korea's Workforce Is Now a Robot". China now surpasses all the west-aligned nations in terms of total industrial robots [1], however the west still has the upper-hand in terms of robot to population density ratio. I think it is a matter of strategy and it seems China's strategy is innovation, science and productivity…

I think another axis is an underlying cultural difference: balance of collectivism vs individualism. China can say “there will be a factory here” because it’s overall good to have one, even if a few noses are out of joint. In California it’s decades of fights to get a train. The trick to competing is to find the right balance for the next decades. China used to be all-central-planning, which was sluggish and not agile. Now it’s guided by central planning (great for overall alignment) over many years rather than jerky 4 year stints, combined with massively distributed efforts to generate high levels of competition and agility. What is the optimal balance for your country or state?

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#168

Post by hackernewds »

bdangubic wrote: post #116
tokioyoyo wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This can't be a serious take, right? Chinese consumers don't expect much less when it comes to maintenance and repair. And given their 3M+/year vehicle production output, they're not a small player.

reach out to countries that sell these cars, find people on social media and/or if you have them in real life or travel… these cars are absolute garbage

not sure what your perspective is based on. gi your persistence, it seems it's likely not rooted in actually talking to these people, but perhaps some slight unconscious bias?

most of the things you use in your kitchen and also your device. you're typing this on were manufactured in China

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#169

Post by hackernewds »

edhelas wrote: post #25

All this to produce machines of 2T to displace 80kg of human on average (think about it, the battery weight more than what it actually need to move on average) and maintain/develop car dependency infrastructures. This is the worst way of improving our efficiency and progress toward a more optimized, efficient economy and reducing massively our climate and biodiversity impact. I want those kind of factories to produce…

Believe it or not, but the buses and trains are also being manufactured in China. if you'd visit, you'd see that they have excellent public infrastructure, with multiple redundancies
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