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The size of BYD's factory

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Re: The size of BYD's factory

#111

Post by TeMPOraL »

wbl wrote: post #97
TeMPOraL wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bike lanes and bikes aren't alternatives to most of what motorized transport is providing.

Most car trips are very short, and commuting to a CBD is easily served by transit.

That still doesn't solve last mile supply of stores and offices, nor does it solve construction, policing, emergency services, etc.

Each of those likely has possible alternatives to motorized transport, but they're all different alternatives. Meanwhile, today, they all share the same road network with regular civilian commute, sharing costs and mutually improving efficiency.

Put differently: instead of imagining all passenger cars replaced by bikes, imagine all roads replaced by bike lanes, then extrapolate from that.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#112

Post by p2detar »

edhelas wrote: post #25

All this to produce machines of 2T to displace 80kg of human on average (think about it, the battery weight more than what it actually need to move on average) and maintain/develop car dependency infrastructures. This is the worst way of improving our efficiency and progress toward a more optimized, efficient economy and reducing massively our climate and biodiversity impact. I want those kind of factories to produce…

There is a clear reason why such factories are being built in China and if you are a USA or German citizen, you wouldn't like it.

In a BBC article from a couple of days ago [0], they hinted that China intends to take the lead into transitioning developing countries from fossil fuels to green tech. They produce batteries, EVs and solar panels. Just this year alone Pakistan of all the countries, imported 13 gigawatts (GW) of solar panels. For context - the UK has 17GW of installed solar in total.

China is aiming to take place #1 as top world economy and it is near perfect how they plan to frame it - as a climate change friendly initiative.

0 - https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3rx2drd8x8o

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#113

Post by acdha »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #87
wbl wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that expensive to put down a bike lane.

Bike lanes and bikes aren't alternatives to most of what motorized transport is providing.

At least 80% of urban car trips could be replaced since the invention of the e-cargo bike. That doesn’t mean it works everywhere, of course, but there are millions and millions of people driving a single digit number of miles, usually at slower than bicycle doors-to-door speeds, and are never carrying 3+ kids and hundreds of pounds of cargo.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#114

Post by TeMPOraL »

acdha wrote: post #113
TeMPOraL wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bike lanes and bikes aren't alternatives to most of what motorized transport is providing.

At least 80% of urban car trips could be replaced since the invention of the e-cargo bike. That doesn’t mean it works everywhere, of course, but there are millions and millions of people driving a single digit number of miles, usually at slower than bicycle doors-to-door speeds, and are never carrying 3+ kids and hundreds of pounds of cargo.

Think roads, not cars.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#115

Post by jimjimjim »

recursive wrote: post #69
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> not that expensive to put down a bike lane Scale-wise insufficient. We aren’t going to get to net zero with bike lanes.

Who said net zero? Perfect is the enemy of good.

Comments like these need to be included in almost any discussion about transport or in fact any discussion about any change. Most people (or both sides) dismiss ideas because they are not 100% perfect. And ignore the fact that nothing can be perfect

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#116

Post by bdangubic »

tokioyoyo wrote: post #104
bdangubic wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

west can compete. unlike byd’s, which get bricked all the time without infrastructure to maintain and repair them, west (and japan even more so) build cars that last. this is china we are talking about, the last thing I want is a car made by them… :)

This can't be a serious take, right? Chinese consumers don't expect much less when it comes to maintenance and repair. And given their 3M+/year vehicle production output, they're not a small player.

reach out to countries that sell these cars, find people on social media and/or if you have them in real life or travel… these cars are absolute garbage

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#117

Post by bdangubic »

acdha wrote: post #102
bdangubic wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

west can compete. unlike byd’s, which get bricked all the time without infrastructure to maintain and repair them, west (and japan even more so) build cars that last. this is china we are talking about, the last thing I want is a car made by them… :)

Do you have any data about that? I have only heard the opposite from owners and it sounds a lot like the things Americans used to say about Japanese cars prior to getting stomped by them in the 80s.

two friends in russia, traveled to mexico twice this year, boss from australia… story after story after story always the same, amazeballs for X number of days and then get bricked, interior issues, steering …

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#118

Post by _aaed »

Archelaos wrote: post #86
poniko wrote: post #3

The scale is just insane .. hard to comprehend a 3km/2mi wide factory.

To my knowledge the largest factory in the world is BASF Ludwigshafen (Germany) with 10 km². Here is an aerial photo: https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:LudwigshafenBASF2017-0... Followed by Volkswagen Wolfsburg (also Germany) with 6.5 km². Seems the BYD factory is competing with it for rank #2.

It will be 50 sq. km by the time the extension is finished [1].

[1] https://twitter.com/TaylorOgan/status/1859149340897628545

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#119

Post by Animats »

EasyMark wrote: post #71
Teever wrote: post #28

I wonder if they built that factory to be resistant to bombing and how much air defense they plan to put around it when they take Taiwan. I also wonder how fast it can be converted to spit out drones.

They won’t be able to take Taiwan. Taiwan has enough missiles to wipe out China’s navy 10x over before the US steps in with our navy

Look at a map of Taiwan. Or better, look at it in Google Earth. Taiwan is a narrow island with a mountain range running north-south down the middle. The developed areas are west of the mountains, facing China, in a strip 15 to 30km wide.

There's no defensive depth. And nowhere for all the people to go in an attack. It's not like Ukraine, where the current fighting is like battling over Iowa, one farm at a time. It's more like Gaza, with too many people crammed into too little land. But bigger.

China has a large number of truck-mounted anti-ship missiles. Bringing US Navy ships in the Taiwan strait means losing many of them. The PLAN has more ships than the US Navy, and is building more at a high rate.

Re: The size of BYD's factory

#120

Post by matthewdgreen »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #79

Wild, fascinating, frightening.

It's great news in the sense that this new energy storage and EV production capacity is (part of) our best chance to avoid catastrophic outcomes from climate change.

It's terrifying because we (in the West) can't seem to motivate ourselves to do anything like this on the same timescale, and nations that suffered similar disparities in industrial capacity (not to mention energy production) haven't done well in the past.

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