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What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

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101–110 of 159 posts

Re: What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

#101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IPv8 is accepting RFCs

Earth has about 2^170 atoms. If we ignore the core and mantle, focusing on the crust, surface and atmosphere, we should be able to cram it into IPv6. Even if we add a couple planets and moons in the future. At least if we stop giving each person 18 quintillion IPs just because we once thought encoding MAC addresses in the lower 64 bits was a good idea.

Addressing isn't really the big issue with IPv6. The main issue is that moving to mobile networks means all its assumptions about how routing will work are wrong, since you don't want to lose IP connections when you move across cell towers.

Re: What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

#103
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But apart from the aqueducts, what have the Romans ever done for us?

Okay, but apart from orthography and aquaducts, what have the Romans ever done for us? Now as punishment go write this on the wall 100 times!

Seeing the comedy beats of that scene play out on HN, first unintentionally and then intentionally, has made my day!

Re: What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

#104
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But apart from the aqueducts, what have the Romans ever done for us?

Okay, but apart from orthography and aquaducts, what have the Romans ever done for us? Now as punishment go write this on the wall 100 times!

[deleted]

Re: What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

#105
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me that Monty Python and the Holy Grail contributed actual historical knowledge about Arthurian legends to my knowledge base while growing up. Other examples of Python unintentional education include knowing the names of a myriad of obscure cheeses (the cheese shop skit), a shocking number of anachronistic synonyms for death (the parrot skit) and notable contributions of the Roman Empire (Life of Brian '…

The problem is that comedy is frequently not factually accurate. Roman Imperial contributions? Was Roman wine better than pre-Roman wine in that region? Did they improve sanitation, irrigation, medicine etc.? Rome was an oppressive slavery based society. Then what about the Spanish Inquisition sketch? It keeps repeating "fanatically devoted to the Pope"" The Spanish inquisition was an arm of the Spanish monarchy, at…

The "what have the Romans done for us" sketch is partly about Rome, but largely a disguised defense of the British Empire.

Re: What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

#107
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But apart from the aqueducts, what have the Romans ever done for us?

well, being part of the Roman Republic/Empire meant peace, even if it was enforced at the tip of a pilum. And the population under the Empire were more prosperous and numerous, so much that the collapse of the Empire in the West had long-lasting negative consequences (I'm mostly basing my opinion off this article: https://acoup.blog/2022/02/11/collections-rome-decline-and-f... )

Ok, but beside the aqueducts, orthography and lasting peace, what good were the Romans for us?

Re: What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a pre-industrial agricultural society, slavery or something similar (serfdom etc.) tends to be widespread, as human and animal muscles are the only reliable and ubiquitous source of energy. Humanity only really started getting rid of unfree backbreaking work by adopting steam engines. 300-400 years ago, most of us forists here would be unfree people working the fields in unfavorable conditions, with maybe 5 per ce…

It's not that pre-industrial society causes slavery, it's closer to the other way round. If you're pre-industrial then everyone has to do farm work, yes, but slavery is /economically inefficient/ because the slaves don't provide demand (since you don't pay them) and don't grow the economy. This is why economics was called "the dismal science" - economists told people to stop doing slavery and the slaveowners called t…

Nope. If the only kilowatts at your disposal are the ones that you, your slaves and your horses can digest, you cannot just upscale the production of goods (or anything else) arbitrarily. The whole economy is bottlenecked on production which is bottlenecked on energy supply. Increasing the demand when supply is the problem would only make things worse.

However once you're burning coal (or harness the wind in case of dutch) things are very different, kilowatts flow freely and all the things you say above start to be true.

Re: What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

#109
post #82
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that comedy is frequently not factually accurate. Roman Imperial contributions? Was Roman wine better than pre-Roman wine in that region? Did they improve sanitation, irrigation, medicine etc.? Rome was an oppressive slavery based society. Then what about the Spanish Inquisition sketch? It keeps repeating "fanatically devoted to the Pope"" The Spanish inquisition was an arm of the Spanish monarchy, at…

…I think it kinda goes without saying that , perhaps with a very few notable exceptions, satirical television shows are not necessarily renown for their historical, scientific, or anecdotal accuracy. That being said, in my own experience at least, such pseudo-historical references in comedy in particular have spurred me on to independent investigation as to what they were on about, exactly. I’d say that the slapdash…

> in slavery they were contemporary with most societies of their day

> Ultimately, there are probably very few, if any, living humans that cannot trace their cultural heritage to slavery

Indeed. Historically, for most of human civilization, chattel slavery was a linchpin of most societies. The Romans were unremarkable in this respect.

And if I may take a long digression to emphasize just how normal chattel slavery was for not only the ancient world, but for centuries after the fall of the Western Roman Empire, it took Christianity to mount a challenge to this practice. It gave us a robust notion of the Imago Dei and human dignity, and a recognition of the evil of unjust servitude (which must be distinguished from just title servitude). Ancient Christians, having been born into a pagan world of entrenched and ubiquitous slavery, while believing that slavery was indeed evil, recognized that its abolition was impossible and impractical at the time. Of course, membership in the Church was open to everyone equally; social status had no significance. After Christianity's legalization under Constantine, the Church worked to free slaves and eventually managed to eradicate the practice in Europe. A former slave even became pope (Callistus I).

Some will point to chattel slavery in the New World, but this confuses what the Church as an institution held with what individual Catholics or Protestants did. Eugenius IV, prompted by slavery in the Canary Islands, condemned slavery in the papal bull Sicut Dudum in 1435, threatening excommunication. In 1537, Paul III issued Sublimus Dei to condemn enslavement of the natives of the Americas. In 1591, Gregory XIV promulgated Cum Sicuti to counter the practice in the Philippines. Urban VIII promulgated Commissum Nobis in 1639 in support of Philip IV's edict prohibiting the enslavement of American natives. Benedict XIV, in his 1741 document Immensa Pastorum, reminded that the penalty for enslaving the indigenous was excommunication.

Similar condemnations were issued regarding the Atlantic slave trade by Innocent XI, Gregory XVI (In Supremo, 1839), and Leo XIII in two bulls condemning slavery in 1888 and 1890. The condemnations were often so harsh that their publication was often forbidden without royal approval.

And we credit the abolitionists of and from the Christian West for politically ending the practice in their various respective jurisdictions that fell under Western rule. Their appeals were grounded in the general heritage of the Christian tradition and its understanding of the human person, whatever theological or philosophical differences there might have been between them.

> What matters is what -you- chose to do. Be known for the fruit of your tree, and not as the product of the hill from which you sprout.

Wise words. History ought to be remembered, and unresolved historical trauma should be addressed and resolved lest it fester (reasonable justice and remembrance matter; without truth, there is no authentic reconciliation or unity), but to stew perpetually in stomach-churning grievance over what someone else's ancestors did to your ancestors (often overlapping groups, btw) only succeeds in wasting the short time we have in this life and contributes nothing to it. It's an excellent method of self-sabotage.

Re: What is the origin of the lake tank image that has become a meme? (2021)

#110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that pre-industrial society causes slavery, it's closer to the other way round. If you're pre-industrial then everyone has to do farm work, yes, but slavery is /economically inefficient/ because the slaves don't provide demand (since you don't pay them) and don't grow the economy. This is why economics was called "the dismal science" - economists told people to stop doing slavery and the slaveowners called t…

Nope. If the only kilowatts at your disposal are the ones that you, your slaves and your horses can digest, you cannot just upscale the production of goods (or anything else) arbitrarily. The whole economy is bottlenecked on production which is bottlenecked on energy supply. Increasing the demand when supply is the problem would only make things worse. However once you're burning coal (or harness the wind in case of…

I would say that inventing new technologies is one of the things that isn't possible when you've enslaved the inventors and made them farmworkers.

I mean, making them do research might work. That's a command economy, aka actually existing communism. Should be able to invent the waterwheel and crop rotation.

I do think it's hard to invent antibiotics and the Haber-Bosch process, and without that you are still in a Malthusian economy where everyone's going to die if they slack off farming.

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