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DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

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Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#701

Post by msabalau »

tbrownaw wrote: post #653
addicted wrote: post #446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google isn’t “getting targeted”. But to answer your question. 1. Microsoft gets left alone - Really? You may want to ask the closest adult near you about this. 2. Amazon - The government has looked into Amazon multiple times. It’s hard to see where Amazon does anything to illegally use its monopoly (they don’t use their shopping advantage to cross sell AWS in any way, or Vice versa). Amazon is genuinely not a bad mon…

> Microsoft gets left alone - Really? You may want to ask the closest adult near you about this. I've got some bad news for you: 2001 was 23 years ago. It's possible to not just be a legal adult (18) but also old enough to drink (21) and still not have been born yet when that was going down.

Or run for Congress in the midterms if they are 25 by the time of the next election two years from now.

Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#702

Post by nl »

ThePhysicist wrote: post #481
jeswin wrote: post #329

I'm totally fine with this, but I wish they would do the same thing with Apple. Google's platform, at the very least is open and I can run my own apps. One could ask, "How is Apple a Monopoly, and do they abuse that position?". In my view it is, since you can't have a business or build connected hardware without an iOS app. And as for abusing that position for gaining market share, there are just too many examples st…

Apple doesn't have a similar position in any space though, or do they? In terms of market share they're not even the biggest player in the smartphone market, they sit below 20 % (the most profitable 20 % though). Google, in comparison, absolutely dominates the search and ad markets and sucks all oxygen out of them to keep any competition from springing up by controlling distribution and limiting choice. They e.g. pai…

Apple has 57% of the US phone market: https://www.oberlo.com/statistics/us-smartphone-market-share

Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#703

Post by iosjunkie »

fransje26 wrote: post #683
jeswin wrote: post #329

I'm totally fine with this, but I wish they would do the same thing with Apple. Google's platform, at the very least is open and I can run my own apps. One could ask, "How is Apple a Monopoly, and do they abuse that position?". In my view it is, since you can't have a business or build connected hardware without an iOS app. And as for abusing that position for gaining market share, there are just too many examples st…

> One could ask, "How is Apple a Monopoly, and do they abuse that position?" I opened my local configurator to buy a 13" M3 MacBook Air. Memory, update from 16GB to 24GB -> +230€ SSD, update from 256GB to 2TB -> +920€ Textbook monopolistic price gouging.

Aston Martin charges $1000 to add a six CD changer in the trunk of Vanquish.

Clearly textbook price gouging from the monopolistic auto manufacturer, Aston Martin.

Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#704

Post by japhib »

jeswin wrote: post #329

I'm totally fine with this, but I wish they would do the same thing with Apple. Google's platform, at the very least is open and I can run my own apps. One could ask, "How is Apple a Monopoly, and do they abuse that position?". In my view it is, since you can't have a business or build connected hardware without an iOS app. And as for abusing that position for gaining market share, there are just too many examples st…

There’s a similar antitrust lawsuit against Apple: https://www.npr.org/2024/09/20/nx-s1-5119948/a-look-at-the-d...

These things take a long time, though. I think the Apple one is just not as far along.

Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#705

Post by Workaccount2 »

hilbert42 wrote: post #205
curiouscat321 wrote: post #5

Who would possibly buy Chrome? Letting any of the large tech companies purchase it (the only possible buyers) would just give someone else monopolistic power. Chrome can’t exist as a standalone business without being even more consumer hostile.

"Who would possibly buy Chrome?" This is illustrates the extent and magnitude of the problem to fix the internet. That regulators failed to give enough oversight of the internet and to regulate its monopolistic players several decades ago when these problems first became obvious has meant that they are now almost insurmountable. Ideally, Google would be forced to divest itself of Chrome and that Chrome would become a…

The fundamental core problem with the internet is that users have an innate feeling that they have a right to view content without being charged for it.

Google's entire existence is predicated on the ad-model internet existing, and internet users have overwhelmingly voted for this model of internet over the last 30 years.

People hate ads, but they hate opening their wallet even more.

Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#706

Post by throwaway2037 »

pjc50 wrote: post #548
rkharsan64 wrote: post #510

People here seem to be underestimating the advantages that Google gets just because of Chrome: - When you sign in to Google, you sign in browser-wide. Google now gets all of your browsing data, perfect for advertising. (If you ever doubt it, go check out Google Takeout. You'll be shocked at the amount of data you see there.) - They have special APIs and features that they get to use, and nobody else. Only because the…

The problem is this: - the browser is undeniably critical as everyone's window through which they view the online world; - the user gains a huge amount of value by a browser being integrated into the OS, webviews in other applications, etc - browsers aren't really a self funding product - having a single for-profit US advertising company control everyone's view of the online world, however slightly (e.g. by obstructi…

You raise some very important points.

Specifically, this one:

    > browsers aren't really a self funding product
I feel the same. I also feel the same about a modern C library and C compiler (and C++, if you like). They are essential to build any modern system and applications. Yet, those are also (mostly) no longer self-funding products.

What do you think will happen if Google is forced to divest Chrome?

Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#707

Post by japhib »

SpEd3Y wrote: post #417

Arguably out of the big 4 (Google, Microsoft, Apple, Amazon) Google gave the most back to humanity: Android, Chromium, Kubernetes, Google Office suite, the Go programming language, Tensor Flow, Alpha Fold (and Google DeepMind), donating to Linux, etc. All these are things everyone has access to precisely because Google is such a big player and can afford to lose money on innovation that fails. What did Microsoft and…

Microsoft had significant antitrust penalties back in the early 2000s due to windows/IE.

The other 3 all have antitrust lawsuits currently going. Google’s is just the furthest along.

Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#708

Post by bee_rider »

InsomniacL wrote: post #526
ThePhysicist wrote: post #481

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple doesn't have a similar position in any space though, or do they? In terms of market share they're not even the biggest player in the smartphone market, they sit below 20 % (the most profitable 20 % though). Google, in comparison, absolutely dominates the search and ad markets and sucks all oxygen out of them to keep any competition from springing up by controlling distribution and limiting choice. They e.g. pai…

> Apple doesn't have a similar position in any space though, or do they? Apple has exclusive control over a market (AppStore), which has almost 2 million different products (Apps), 820,000 suppliers (app publishers) and over 1.3 billion customers (active iPhone users) which conducts more trade ($1.1 trillion) than the entire GDP of Luxemburg. If that's not a monopoly i don't know what is.

The argument as to whether smartphones or the Apple App Store is the better definition of a market has been done to death at this point, right? IMO it would be more good faith to just reference the fact that this is a currently entrenched and impossible to reconcile matter of… opinion? Definition?

> If that's not a monopoly i don't know what is.

This level of certainty is not warranted.

Re: DOJ will push Google to sell off Chrome

#710

Post by bee_rider »

iosjunkie wrote: post #703
fransje26 wrote: post #683

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One could ask, "How is Apple a Monopoly, and do they abuse that position?" I opened my local configurator to buy a 13" M3 MacBook Air. Memory, update from 16GB to 24GB -> +230€ SSD, update from 256GB to 2TB -> +920€ Textbook monopolistic price gouging.

Aston Martin charges $1000 to add a six CD changer in the trunk of Vanquish. Clearly textbook price gouging from the monopolistic auto manufacturer, Aston Martin.

Aston Martin doesn’t sell enough cars to be a problem for society. Apple has pretty high market share. I don’t really think they are a monopoly (because I can’t see the point of view that takes a single Apple Store as “the market”), but I think it is obvious that they have more impact than Aston Martin.
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