Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981 • Hacker News Board

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#121

Post by NavinF » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 10:55 PM UTC

jfengel wrote: post #33

mannykannot wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like this quote: “We didn’t design them to last 30 years or 40 years, we designed them not to fail,” John Casani, Voyager project manager from 1975 to 1977, says in a NASA statement.

That doesn't seem helpful. Nothing lasts forever, and if you don't figure out when it's going to fail, it's going to be sooner rather than later.

FWIW his quote also applies to a lotta devices here on Earth. For example guns are not designed to last forever, but they are designed not to fail. You don't want to hear a click when you expect a bang or vice versa. As a side effect, they last forever. It's fairly common for a 100 year old gun to work perfectly in 2024.

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#122

Post by ChoHag » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 10:59 PM UTC

jonplackett wrote: post #17

Were engineers 50 years ago just much smarter than we are now? It’s pretty unbelievable that these things still work. Or is there something systemic about how they were able to achieve so much so long ago with basically no computers to help.

[dead]

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#123

Post by khuey » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 11:04 PM UTC

exmadscientist wrote: post #90

grapesodaaaaa wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m trying to figure out why the alignment was so important. Wouldn’t it be possible to get a gravity assist in any alignment - albeit just taking a little longer to ping-pong across the system?

The alignment was important because it allowed visiting four planets with one spacecraft. So you only had to launch one spacecraft. (We launched two anyway.) If you are willing to launch four spacecrafts to visit four planets, the alignment restrictions are much relaxed. You do need to be careful about your launch window to get a nice boost, but it's measured in years between windows, not so much centuries.

> The alignment was important because it allowed visiting four planets with one spacecraft. So you only had to launch one spacecraft. (We launched two anyway.)

IIRC the second probe was mainly intended as a backup to the first one, but visiting Titan and visiting Uranus/Neptune were mutually exclusive, and visiting Titan was higher priority, so if the first probe succeeded the backup could be (and was) sent on the four planet track.

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#124

Post by ianburrell » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 11:11 PM UTC

gruturo wrote: post #24

metalman wrote: post #7

It's too bad this cant qualify as some sort of world record

We have to way to know it it's actually the fastest and farthest object: A 1957 nuclear test was conducted underground, but the scientists decided to cap the borehole with a sizable concrete and metal plug. The nuclear explosion may or may not have caused said plug to reach space - the data from the cameras indicate it had at least 6 times the needed escape velocity, but it is difficult to estimate whether it would c…

Calculations show that it was completely destroyed in the atmosphere. Which makes sense, cause meteorites of similar size don't make it to the ground.

It was also slower, 150,000 mph, than Parker Solar Probe, which reached 430,000 mph.

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#125

Post by KennyBlanken » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 11:12 PM UTC

bigiain wrote: post #105

kibwen wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It wasn't just a lucky break, it was the result of furious efforts by scientists to lobby years in advance to take advantage of the alignment, as well as engineers who repurposed two Mariner probes to save money, as well as canny NASA bureaucrats who sneakily downplayed the possibility of a full Grand Tour in order to reduce estimated costs (with the full intent to underpromise and overdeliver, which Voyager 2 succes…

Still a huge amount of luck involved. If that planetary alignment had happened even 10 years earlier NASA probably wouldn't have had the capability to do anything with it. If it had been sometime recently, say after the Challenger disaster, I doubt it would have got funding...

There's no way that a disaster on a manned mission would affect a satellite launch. They share nothing in common.

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#126

Post by jonas21 » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 11:16 PM UTC

noselasd wrote: post #117

gdubs wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was also incredibly on budget. I think Sagan says in the book it cost the individual American taxpayers in the single digit dollars.

Single digit dollar sounds more like the Appollo program. I think it's been a long time since the entire NASA budget was more than a penny per tax dollar. NASA says the voyager mission cost 865 million dollars from the start in 1972 to Neptune encounter in 1989, and currently runs at 7 mllion dollars per year.

So that would be $7.72 per taxpayer, a single-digit dollar amount.

(based on number of taxpayers in 1989 -- using the numbers from 1972, it would be a low double-digit amount).

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#127

Post by KennyBlanken » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 11:18 PM UTC

sumeno wrote: post #56

jfengel wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't seem helpful. Nothing lasts forever, and if you don't figure out when it's going to fail, it's going to be sooner rather than later.

Maybe the guy who helped launch the two manmade objects furthest from earth knows more about how to build space probes than you

Shhhh, this is HN, where just like on reddit, a bunch of computer programmers think they know more than a professional in said professional's field.

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#128

Post by ethagknight » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 11:25 PM UTC

Would there not be some kind of benefit to send a chaser after the probes in order to act as a relay as the signal gets further away? Or is the ground based array just as good as anything we could put in space at this time?

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#129

Post by ta988 » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 11:29 PM UTC

ethagknight wrote: post #128

Would there not be some kind of benefit to send a chaser after the probes in order to act as a relay as the signal gets further away? Or is the ground based array just as good as anything we could put in space at this time?

Wouldn't it be difficult as one would need large antennas and excellent alignment?

Voyager to earth is "relatively" easy it "just" beams toward the sun. And earth can afford to get big antennas scanning.

Re: Voyager 1 breaks its silence with NASA via radio transmitter not used since 1981

#130

Post by wkat4242 » Sun, Nov 17, 2024, 11:29 PM UTC

ethagknight wrote: post #128

Would there not be some kind of benefit to send a chaser after the probes in order to act as a relay as the signal gets further away? Or is the ground based array just as good as anything we could put in space at this time?

No, their RTGs are almost exhausted anyway so soon they won't have enough power to run anything.