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Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

theguardian.com

121–130 of 136 posts

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#121
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How on earth is requiring card payments discriminatory? Providing cash payment options is absolutely not free and implies extra risk on behalf of the business. Refusing to take part in the banking system is not worth penalizing businesses for. Let the free market work.

Because not everyone has access to cards?

Legal residents absolutely 100% all have _access_ to cards, whether they choose to use them is another matter.

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#122
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How on earth is requiring card payments discriminatory? Providing cash payment options is absolutely not free and implies extra risk on behalf of the business. Refusing to take part in the banking system is not worth penalizing businesses for. Let the free market work.

Ever see a homeless schizophrenic? Do you think they have a bank account?

This is a strawman. The homeless schizophrenic is clearly not capable of caring for themselves, so their inability to participate in society should not impose restrictions on all businesses.

The problem you cite is not solved by requiring businesses to accept cash—it is solved by removing the homeless schizophrenic from the depravity of the street.

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good question. In Switzerland you could buy real estate with cash until very recently. You could also open a front, say a barbershop or a restaurant, though convincing authorities you earned a million or more through that could be a stretch.

Can you not, still? It may be reportable under AML rules, but it's still possible?

You are right and it seems I misread the media articles.

Wouldn’t recommend it to GP though because they asked about circumventing AML and this would catch the fraud chief from the article.

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#124
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because not everyone has access to cards?

Legal residents absolutely 100% all have _access_ to cards, whether they choose to use them is another matter.

Don't you need to be above a certain age to have a card?

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#125
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of those "if you don't already know" topics. The feds cracked down on it earlier this year leading up to the election, but it's back.

Why can't anyone say what it is?

I can, but I won't. The state doesn't like it, because it bypasses the points at which they control the system (largely without due process) and I don't wish to make their jobs any easier for them.

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#126
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't like it, but I think the long term plan is to eliminate paper money, and with it privacy. I live in the Netherlands and you can really live 100% cash-free here. A lot of places are card-only, even.

Dystopian future here we come! Cashless seems cool until you realise one day they decide to turn off your access to money, or tax you more based on your spending pattern. The possibilities for abuse are endless so it WILL be abused.

Don't start me. Besides that, there's the fact that card-only is giving free rein to the boards of MasterCard and Visa to decide what's effectively legal; it's already the case in the adult industry, where the card companies have enacted rules for performers, production and distributors. No agree, no money. What happens if the next CEO is an evangelical Christian?

And of course cashless makes it hell on those without bank accounts, like the homeless and immigrants, those who rely on informal employment, and the general outskirts of society. There are prepaid cards, but they require ID checks and often fees which they can hardly afford. That will make many rely on informal banking from loan-shark types.

And last, the banks see everything. I worked for a bank. I definitely don't want those people to have all the data that matters on everyone.

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#127
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ever see a homeless schizophrenic? Do you think they have a bank account?

This is a strawman. The homeless schizophrenic is clearly not capable of caring for themselves, so their inability to participate in society should not impose restrictions on all businesses. The problem you cite is not solved by requiring businesses to accept cash—it is solved by removing the homeless schizophrenic from the depravity of the street.

Many people at the margin don't have bank accounts. Not only schizophrenics, but undocumented immigrants or the homeless. There are a lot of undocumented immigrants and homeless.

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#128
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Convicted ex-money launderer here. It's easy. Never dealt with €20M but the principle is scaleable, you smurf the money in ~€10k amounts through a network of trusted money mules. You buy a cash-only/mostly business like a car wash, take-away etc., rent half-a dozen shops and pump the cash through those, banks won't usually complain about cash coming in like this. €5k * 52 * {y stores}. There are entire areas of shops…

In your opinion, what fraction of the small restaurants in a typical city are engaging in money laundering at this scale? And if weighted by volume, what fraction?

I think it's not so much restaurants, as the setup and operation costs are higher, but countertop takeaways I think. I'm not aware of any data but I'd guess from conversations & experience it was just a fraction - single percents? But I have no clue really. For a good ML operation you need agility: easy quick and cheap to set up & teardown and move - hence takeaways, hand carwashes etc.

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#129
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would make sense, but I don't think it's ever mentioned. It is specifically mentioned that Marty books expenses that he hasn't actually incurred, notionally buying things that he never receives, which will stand up to an audit much more poorly than "buying overpriced things from cartel-owned enterprises" would.

There’s the scene where Marty takes rooms at the Blue Cat Lodge off the market for renovations, against Rachel’s objections that he wait for the off season, suggesting real stuff is actually being done to them. Then later she confronts him over paying ridiculous prices related for said renovations. (Where she also threatens to report him.) His cartel contact Del is mentioned as running a construction and remodeling b…

Yes, he does real renovations. But he notes to his wife that he's purchased X square feet of carpet at $Y per square foot, while accounting for it as XXX square feet at $YYY per foot. (Both figures much higher than the reality.)

The difference between $YYY and $Y is money that was claimed to change hands, but never did, and the difference between XXX and X is carpeting that Marty has recorded himself purchasing, but not actually purchased.

If he was buying the carpeting from a cartel-owned supplier, he'd just pay the inflated prices that he's so proud of booking without paying. Instead, he's buying real services from a real third party, and then booking fake expenses for unclear reasons.

Re: Spanish police arrest ex-fraud chief after €20M found in walls of his house

#130
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because not everyone has access to cards?

Legal residents absolutely 100% all have _access_ to cards, whether they choose to use them is another matter.

Do you know what a huge amount of labor in your society depends on people who are not legal residents, or don’t have identity documentation?

You don’t want those people to not be able to buy food, or the next time you go and buy vegetables or fruits or chicken breast with your own shiny metal bank card, you might find yourself paying 5x the cost.

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