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Universe would die before monkey with keyboard writes Shakespeare, study finds

theguardian.com

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Re: Universe would die before monkey with keyboard writes Shakespeare, study finds

#161
post #134
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very computer science and not scientific response, but I look at the Game of Life, and it makes me realize that little patterns naturally form everywhere. Biology is just a little pattern that wants to replicate and survive and that doesn't have to mean intelligently.

> Biology is just a little pattern that wants to replicate and survive I don't really see biology as being a "little" pattern. To me, looking at the jump from replicating molecules in chemical soup to single cell organisms is like looking at the jump from an abacus to an Intel i9 processor.

Who said you had to junp to single celled organisms first? One of the oldest displays at a science museum I remember was very simple. It was basically a rubber sheet attached to the top of a spinning pole resmebling a folded umbrella without the spines. There was a adjustable knob you could play with to adjust the speed that it spun. It would start from zero. Versus interestingly to me, the exhibit demonstrated that at certain speeds the dangling edge of the rubber sheet would form nice sine waves at certain speeds. It might be chaotic at first but eventually, given just the right amount of energy to spin, the wave would appear. If you sped it up or slowed it down, sometimes the wave would collapse, but if you hit another natural frequency, it would eventually snap into a larger or smaller amplitude with a greater or lesser amplitude. My take away was that if there is enough energy and repetition to almost anything, eventually patterns will arise. And if you let them do that long enough, then even in imperfect environments, relatively stable outcomes would occur. Much like life in my opinion. Have enough chemicals and energy thrashing around long enough in a cycle, and enough adverse selection against all those structures, eventually some structures will emerge and self-reinforce. Doesn't gotta start with cells, just molecules.

Re: Universe would die before monkey with keyboard writes Shakespeare, study finds

#162
post #151
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sequence replaces an infinite God with ~infinite time and then draws the wrong conclusion.

You're replacing a hypothetical situation meant to illustrustrate mathematics with something else. The monkeys don't eat, evolve, age, conspire, have agendas or agency, they type randomly as a means to invoke visual imagery of a monkey slamming it's hands down ignorantly on a typewriter. It's chaotic slamming is the "input" that gets eventually distributed in different ways, one of which, if given enough time, will b…

This sub-thread moved on from the original hypothesis as soon as innagadadavida put forward his non-empirical empirical example. Take it up with him, he may also enjoy your evaluation of his rationality.

Re: Universe would die before monkey with keyboard writes Shakespeare, study finds

#163

The theorem is called "infinite monkey theorem". That means infinite amount of time. A googol years is not infinite, it's infinite times smaller than that. In an infinite amount of time they will write Shakespeare works (if they type randomly enough and not with some bias like never typing certain combinations of letters) Also, at least the article could have said what the actual probability is then? Are we talking 1…

Yes, I always imagined this being just a silly exercise in pulling out a finite outcome from infinity. It’s not meant to be provable or disprovable, just hard to comprehend because we cannot think in infinite terms.

Relatedly, I wrote an essay that covers this a few years back: https://medium.com/@beadey.teigh/typewriters-29309c8e3b71

Re: Universe would die before monkey with keyboard writes Shakespeare, study finds

#164
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just read the paper directly: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S277318632... . They do no such thing.

Yes, and no… > Here, we consider the Finite Monkeys Theorem and look at the probability of a given string being typed by one of a finite number of monkeys within a finite time allocation consistent with estimates for the lifespan of our universe But point taken, the article is sensationalizing.

Finite Monkeys Theorem is not the same as the Infinite Monkeys Theorem
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